All in all it was a really good learning experience. Sure lets you know how you will react when something more severe than an open door in flight occurs.
-Tholl
Todays little adventure!
Moderators: North Shore, sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, Right Seat Captain, lilfssister
Todays little adventure!
Went out to CYAV today to do some more flying on the arrow at WPG aviation. Went up with another pilot that has his CPL, we startup and our origonal intent was to go to kenora. But ofcourse that didn't work out. We departed on 36, and shorty after departure, we heard a lot of wind and felt a good FREEZING COLD DRAFT! The door was open about 1/4 inch. So i requested to head back to st.andrews on a right downwind for 36. Touched down and pulled off the runway while my buddy closed the door "tightly. We took off again, at 2500ft, mr.co-pilot is playing with the latch because it was still not fully closed. Next thing I know the door swings wide open and my buddy grabs it and is holding it shut with all his streighth. So i switch back to CYAV's tower freq. and ask for yet another "immidiate" landing. The only problem was that I could not hear their responce due to all the wind that is coming into the cockpit. I turn up all the radios and just hear ATC very quietly in the background. I told them that I could not hear them due to the problem at hand and to shoot me some light gun signals. By this time we are both absolutly forzen, and I am trying to get all the nessissary checks done while he is holding the door shut. I did follow all the proper procedures for when a door opens in flight, but it was a lot worse that I thought it would be. We got a steady green and proceeded to turn inbound and made a beautyful landing back onto 36. As I pulled off the runway I contacted ground and thanked them for their help. Went back and got the door problem fixed up with just a tightening of a screw. Then ofcourse went and took off again, just looking to do some local stuff in the practice area. Once we landed in CYAV after all this took place the controller asked if the door was behaving itself. I responded back by saying, "Yes sir, it's being a good door now!"
All in all it was a really good learning experience. Sure lets you know how you will react when something more severe than an open door in flight occurs.
-Tholl
All in all it was a really good learning experience. Sure lets you know how you will react when something more severe than an open door in flight occurs.
-Tholl
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SuperDave
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Good experience indeed. Once I soloed in the Super Cub and went out on my own, I had a ever present itch to open the doors and fly low over all the canola fields in full bloom. All went well, but most maps, or anything else loose in the cokpit, promtly exited the plane in a most disorganized manner. Sorry...kinda got rambling there...lost my train of thought...
I once had a cowl hinge come loose on a C140 just after take-off. It's similiar to a Cub cowling in that both sides open downward from a hinge in the middle. It was behaving quite violently and it looked as if the whole unit was seconds from disintegration. I just kept flying the plane and made a normal landing. A few weeks later I read an accident report where the same thing happened to another pilot, but he crashed and was fataly injured. There has also been reports of people going down after the door opens. The biggest reason is the distraction and accompaning noise so they say. Aerodynamically everything is basically the same. Good job on flying the plane Tholl and not getting distracted. Aviate, Navigate, Communicate or something right!
Keep on keepin' on.
I once had a cowl hinge come loose on a C140 just after take-off. It's similiar to a Cub cowling in that both sides open downward from a hinge in the middle. It was behaving quite violently and it looked as if the whole unit was seconds from disintegration. I just kept flying the plane and made a normal landing. A few weeks later I read an accident report where the same thing happened to another pilot, but he crashed and was fataly injured. There has also been reports of people going down after the door opens. The biggest reason is the distraction and accompaning noise so they say. Aerodynamically everything is basically the same. Good job on flying the plane Tholl and not getting distracted. Aviate, Navigate, Communicate or something right!
Keep on keepin' on.
Well, when I heard the door open wide, I will admitt I was like WTF!!! What just happened....I just pulled the MP to about 18-20 then just headed for the airport...The first thing that came to my mind was the fact that I wasnt going to be able to hear ATC...which I didnt, but I think that I was on the ball asking for light gun signals as there were 3 other planes in the circuit. It's experiences like this that keep you alert!
-Tholl
-Tholl
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Highflyinpilot
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Right Seat Captain
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Another thing I found suprising is that by friend had to really try to hold the door "shut." He said that it had happened to him while flying a cessna, but this didnt compare at all. I was told by the owner of wpg aviation that the situation that occured is very similar to what it is like when an open door occurs in flight on a travel air. Oh well, got my heart pumpin, and we are all safe, no fines... Would a noise cancelling headset like a bose make it easier to hear in a situation like that? Thanks
-Tholl
Would a noise cancelling headset like a bose make it easier to hear in a situation like that? Thanks-Tholl
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SuperDave
- Rank 3
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- Location: Just the other side of nowhere
A Bose may, or may not help. But either way, the amount of money in your bank account will be directly proportional to your decision to buy, or not to buy a Bose.
There are other good headsets out there that do the trick, although I admit, Bose is the most known. A friend of mine was a survey pilot and owned a Lightspeed and loved it, even on the long days. But if you got cash burning a hole in your pocket, get the Bose...and make sure it has the ipod hook-up that squelches out the tunes when you're trying to hear ATC!
There are other good headsets out there that do the trick, although I admit, Bose is the most known. A friend of mine was a survey pilot and owned a Lightspeed and loved it, even on the long days. But if you got cash burning a hole in your pocket, get the Bose...and make sure it has the ipod hook-up that squelches out the tunes when you're trying to hear ATC!
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cessnafloatflyer
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- Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2005 9:02 pm
I flew a film crew this summer in the C-180 Seaplane with no co-pilot door, everyone strapped in, the aircraft behaves the same. The noise for us was from the rush of air over the cameraman's (in the back seat) mic. Once unplugged, all of the noise wentr away... it was July and still cold...
In the 172 with the door off you get air coming from the back of the airplane past your head as it circles around the cabin. Wind on a mic will sure make it noisy. When the photographer sticks his head outside yikes. So we also usually unplug the mike.
On the door issue with any a/c it is probably going to want to stay open at least a few inches, but even more so on a low wing. It is right in the low pressure area on the top of the wing.
I've had the door open a few times on me, but there is usually someone else (who can fly, on board.) like a student. In those cases I usually have one person fly the A/C while the other slams the door shut. But I applaud your decision to return. Especially if it is really messing with you, and the door is being sucked open.
BTD
On the door issue with any a/c it is probably going to want to stay open at least a few inches, but even more so on a low wing. It is right in the low pressure area on the top of the wing.
I've had the door open a few times on me, but there is usually someone else (who can fly, on board.) like a student. In those cases I usually have one person fly the A/C while the other slams the door shut. But I applaud your decision to return. Especially if it is really messing with you, and the door is being sucked open.
BTD
I have to say the first few times I opened a door in flight, on purpose, was more than a little nerve wracking. the main exit door on jump planes usualy opens up and latches into the wing, leaving you sitting there with a huge 7ft square hole next to you.... 10,000ft straight down to terra firma.
If thats not bad enough, we then get four guys.. BIG guys, basically a 800+lbs worth of human bodies out there hanging in the wind off the strut linking up for their formation jump. You'ld be surprised at what can be onthe outside of your plane and still have it fly.
Well several hundred door openings later the whole thing becomes pretty matter of fact, but I will still never forget the first time.
If thats not bad enough, we then get four guys.. BIG guys, basically a 800+lbs worth of human bodies out there hanging in the wind off the strut linking up for their formation jump. You'ld be surprised at what can be onthe outside of your plane and still have it fly.
Well several hundred door openings later the whole thing becomes pretty matter of fact, but I will still never forget the first time.
Good job. Sounds like you handled it well.
Brings to mind a tip for working with students. Give them the opportunity to experience a similar thing in training. Early in the training (we use 172s) I will open the window in flight to take a picture or something. Many students are a bit apprehensive but see that there's really nothing to it. After that I will get them to open a window to experience the force of the window going up as well as the effort it takes to close it.
Later in their training, once they are competent in taking off and overall flying I will leave my door loosely latched. After takeoff in the climb, well clear of the ground, it will "suddenly" pop open. As a few others have said, it doesn't make that big a difference in a Cessna, but better they experience it with me ready to help if they freak (no one has yet).
It not only reinforces the need for them to insure the checklist items - doors locked, seatbelts secure - are verified and not just mumbled or passed over quickly, but allows them to experience what could be a real-life scenario in a controlled environment.
Brings to mind a tip for working with students. Give them the opportunity to experience a similar thing in training. Early in the training (we use 172s) I will open the window in flight to take a picture or something. Many students are a bit apprehensive but see that there's really nothing to it. After that I will get them to open a window to experience the force of the window going up as well as the effort it takes to close it.
Later in their training, once they are competent in taking off and overall flying I will leave my door loosely latched. After takeoff in the climb, well clear of the ground, it will "suddenly" pop open. As a few others have said, it doesn't make that big a difference in a Cessna, but better they experience it with me ready to help if they freak (no one has yet).
It not only reinforces the need for them to insure the checklist items - doors locked, seatbelts secure - are verified and not just mumbled or passed over quickly, but allows them to experience what could be a real-life scenario in a controlled environment.
Good tip 5X5. I think I may start doing that.
I am a big fan of not having a student experience something for the first time by themselves. I usually try to get them up a few times where the weather is marginal VFR. That way the first time they experience it isn't on a X-country by themselves when they are only used to flying in SKC weather.
BTD
I am a big fan of not having a student experience something for the first time by themselves. I usually try to get them up a few times where the weather is marginal VFR. That way the first time they experience it isn't on a X-country by themselves when they are only used to flying in SKC weather.
BTD
