Southwest 737 off the runway in Chicago

snag · Post by **snag** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 7:12 pm

http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/12/08/chicag ... index.html

Just on CNN now. Oh god, and they got that private pilot aviation expert on again. Looks like everyone on the aircraft is ok. Can't wait for the next episode of "Airline".

BTD · Post by **BTD** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 7:20 pm

Was there a gas station at the end of the runway???

Glad everyone is okay

Dust Devil · Post by **Dust Devil** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 7:33 pm

My guess is this was a pissed off pilot who was mad cause the boss gave him shit for riding the brakes too much.

flyinhigh · Post by **flyinhigh** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 8:02 pm

Well, just talking to a buddy about this,
sounds like they hit a car as well, so umm how do you explain this to your insurance company and your family.

Well uh, I was in a accident today.
Oh what happened,
I was driving down smith and simpson and this damn Boeing 737 Jet Liner ran a red light and ran me over, I even honked my horn but he kept on coming.

ScudRunner · Post by **ScudRunner** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 8:32 pm

Looked to be Snowing heavily. Heard the Reporter who was close to getting his PPL.

flyer 1492 · Post by **flyer 1492** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 10:14 pm

The latest report from CNN is indicating that a child that was riding in one of the cars has died. I wonder what the RFI was at the time of the accident. My condolences to the family.

Flyer

NovaBoy · Post by **NovaBoy** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 4:39 am

Heavy wet snow and a 6500ft runway is not ideal in a 737-700. It will be interesting to see the runway report.

VeRmiLLioN · Post by **VeRmiLLioN** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 5:37 am

A 6 year old has died.

bizjet_mania · Post by **bizjet_mania** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 6:40 am

That is absolutely horrible news, my condolences!

happy_flyer · Post by **happy_flyer** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 12:03 pm

Here's a link to some pics...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/in_pictures/4513116.stm

heeypilot · Post by **heeypilot** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 12:19 pm

wow. i feel horrible for everyone involved in this incident.

imagine the irony in people who are too scared to fly, so they drive everywhere... but then get hit by an airplane while driving their car.

the original tony · Post by **the original tony** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 12:21 pm

not that is any of my business, but a plane going off the end of the runway and killing an innocent civilian doesn't seem like the funniest news.
please, a little respect for the family

My condolences to the little ones family

"tony"

slowstream · Post by **slowstream** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 1:22 pm

I can't imagine losing a child........ especially at Christmas let's keep that family in our prayers as well the crew; I would hate to know I was responsible for a childs death.

rejd · Post by **rejd** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 1:52 pm

the original tony wrote:not that is any of my business, but a plane going off the end of the runway and killing an innocent civilian doesn't seem like the funniest news.
please, a little respect for the family

My condolences to the little ones family

"tony"

Hey Tony. I know either way it is no laughing matter but I beleive the "jokes" were made before they realized someone was killed. Anyway, my codelences go out to the family.

Rej

skyhigh · Post by **skyhigh** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 2:00 pm

you just know that the lawyers are salivating over this one.......

bush pilot · Post by **bush pilot** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 2:15 pm

Redj wrote:

Hey Tony. I know either way it is no laughing matter but I beleive the "jokes" were made before they realized someone was killed. Anyway, my codelences go out to the family.

Rej

I believe The origanal Tony was making a reference to Heypilot, and Vermillion had made it clear that there was a fatality in the accident, so heypilot most likely did know that there was a fatality if he read all the posts.

My condolences goes out to the young ones family, my wife and I are expecting very soon, I could only imagine life without either one of them.

rejd · Post by **rejd** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 2:50 pm

[/quote]
I believe The origanal Tony was making a reference to Heypilot, and Vermillion had made it clear that there was a fatality in the accident, so heypilot most likely did know that there was a fatality if he read all the posts.[/quote]

Sorry, I guess I need to learn to read the posts better. I thought he was referreing to BTD and Dust Devil. I missed that remark by heeypilot.

Rej

orville · Post by **orville** » Sat Dec 10, 2005 12:23 am

LANDED LONG W/13KT TAILWIND !!!!!

Twits.

skyhigh · Post by **skyhigh** » Sat Dec 10, 2005 7:47 am

Without being there you have no right or class for that matter to be calling them "twits".....grow up. The vis was down to half a mile and who knows? maybe that was the only ILS available......Lots of pilots would routinely take a "little" tailwind to accomodate the better approach...or maybe in this case the only approach.

WRX · Post by **WRX** » Sat Dec 10, 2005 10:19 am

RWY 31C

ILS 863/40 250(300 - 3/4)

RWY 13C

ILS 861/50 250(300 - 1)

Visibility requirement for the opposite runway was greater than the one that they used. I'd choose the same rwy myself as well. [/b]

complexintentions · Post by **complexintentions** » Sat Dec 10, 2005 11:14 am

Tailwind limitation on the 737 is ten knots, even if it's the "Only" ILS.

FWIW.

Also, interesting article about the aforementioned lawyers. I hope WestJet is watching this all closely, if you close your eyes and think teal instead of orangey-red, this sounds like it could be a Canadian-regged -700...."profit share! profit share!"

In the Burbank crash of a 737-300, injured parties successfully claimed that SWA fosters a culture of expediency, cost savings and an aggressive 'get the plane down' approach that, in combination, compromised passenger safety," said Mr. Rose, who was involved in the Burbank litigation

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/051209/nyf103.html?.v=19

whipline · Post by **whipline** » Sat Dec 10, 2005 11:27 am

I haven't watched to much of the coverage on this but the maximum tailwind for the 737-700 is 15 knots.

complexintentions · Post by **complexintentions** » Sat Dec 10, 2005 11:39 am

From the AFM:

-Max takeoff / landing tailwind component 10kts (May be 15kts as customer option)
-No tailwind component allowed on contaminated runways.

Perhaps SWA has the 15kt "customer option". So that only leaves the slight problem of the contaminated runway. I won't even touch plain old common sense until more info comes to light.

Beavis · Post by **Beavis** » Sat Dec 10, 2005 12:07 pm

not that is any of my business, but a plane going off the end of the runway and killing an innocent civilian doesn't seem like the funniest news.
please, a little respect for the family

My condolences to the little ones family

By the original Tony

Sure this sucks - for the pilots, for the family in the vehicle, for the kid - but this message board is getting overly sensitive. Make one little in-appropriate crack and the sensitivity police rush in.

As far as this incident goes - I actually don't even have anything in-sensitive to say, or even anything sensitive to say, for that matter. But it is the principle of the thing that bugs me - whatever happened to shooting from the hip and letting the chips fall where they may.

teacher · Post by **teacher** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 10:00 am

Initial reports are that the reversors did not operate as they should. Could be just speculation (although it said that this was stated by "investigators").

Reverse thrusters weren't working properly when plane slid off Chicago runway

23:16:46 EST Dec 10, 2005

CHICAGO (AP) - Reverse thrusters that should have slowed a Southwest Airlines jetliner before it slid off a runway at Midway Airport and into the street didn't immediately kick in when the pilots tried to deploy them, U.S. investigators said Saturday after interviewing the crew.

How much of a role that braking equipment played in Thursday's deadly accident wasn't immediately clear, though, and the investigation is continuing.

The plane's flight attendants told investigators the Boeing 737 didn't appear to slow after it touched down at Midway in a snowstorm Thursday, said Robert Benzon, the U.S. National Transportation Safety Board's investigator in charge.

"They all said it was a smooth landing but they could sense a lack of deceleration," Benzon said.

He said the pilots told investigators they began applying the brakes manually as soon as they noticed the plane wasn't slowing properly. The plane, with 98 passengers aboard, slid through a fence and into street traffic, where it killed a six-year-old boy in a car.

Because of the blowing snow, none of the air traffic controllers actually saw the plane land but more than 10 cameras have been identified that could provide additional information, including details about the runway conditions, Benzon said.

On Saturday, workers used a crane with a sling to lift the damaged airliner off the city street and into a hangar for further inspections.

Southwest said the captain piloting Thursday's flight has been with the airline for more than 10 years and the first officer has flown with Southwest for 2 1/2 years. It was the first fatal crash in the airline's 35-year history.

The plane had been landing in a snowstorm when it slid off the end of the runway, plowed through a fence and struck two cars. Ten people, most of them on the ground, were injured and the boy was killed in a car driven by his father.

The plane's voice and data recorders were sent to Washington for analysis, NTSB member Ellen Engleman Conners said.

Though the airport had about 18 centimetres of snow at the time, aviation officials said conditions were acceptable. Southwest chief executive Gary Kelly said Friday the plane recently had a maintenance check and showed no signs of problems.

Midway - built in 1923 and surrounded by houses and businesses - is among nearly 300 U.S. commercial airports without 300-metre buffer zones at the ends of runways.

Safety experts suggest the airports guard against accidents by using beds of crushable concrete that can slow an aircraft if it slides off the runway's end.

The crushable concrete beds - called Engineered Material Arresting Systems - are installed at 18 runways at 14 airports. They have stopped dangerous overruns three times since May 1999 at Kennedy Airport in New York City.

Chicago Department of Aviation spokeswoman Wendy Abrams could not immediately say whether an arresting system had been considered at Midway.

Some pilots said relatively short runways like Midway's pose a challenge in icy or snowy weather, forcing them to touch down as close as possible to the beginning of the runway to allow more braking time.

"It's not a place you can be a little off," said Richard Ward, a retired United Airlines pilot who occasionally flew into Midway.

"You don't have the variable of a long runway to correct any errors."

http://www.cbc.ca/cp/world/051210/w1210106.html

Southwest 737 off the runway in Chicago

Southwest 737 off the runway in Chicago

....

Sure it sucks - but aren't you all a bit too sensitive.