Part Time Work while training.
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Part Time Work while training.
I work with a large Canadian airline. For a project I'm working on, I'd like to get an idea of how many student pilots work part time to cover expences? How many would be interested in ramp work at an airline to add aviation experience to their resume (flex shifts to accomodate flight training)? Performance evals would be kept on file for when/if you later applied for a pilot position after attaining the required experience. This is NOT a current program, just a priliminary study for long term ramp and aircrew staffing issues.
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av8tor_assrope
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Zapp Brannigan
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The only thing is an employee would be leaving the company (ramp job) to get the flying experience before being hired back as a pilot at a later date. A pilot may not return unless some sort of incentive was given. The incentive would not have to be much, but being hired with less hours that a non-employee is what I'm thinking.
thanks, keep up the replies.
I'd make it a poll but i'm not sure if we can post a poll on this site.
One of the issues airlines have, or any employer for that matter, is how to get an understanding of a person's attitude and work ethic. Sure you can check for prangs and violations, and a SIM check will generally tell if they can keep the blue side up. But a picture of what a person is like to work with is a bit harder to make. Personal and employer references have limitations. Some guys will talk up a pilot just cause they're a buddy, or diss them cause they wouldn't do a shift trade at the old company or dated the cute F/A that they were after. Same with employers, blow sunshine cause they want to get rid of the guy or diss him/her because they wouldn't bust minimums or clean the boss' pool.
But if the applicant has already worked for you, the employer should have a very clear picture of what that worker is like. Then its just a case of the pilot aquiring the skills and experience needed. Also, the pilot applicant already knows the company, how it works, the politics, pay etc.. so if they still apply, they know what they are getting into.
One of the things we do NOT want to ever do is require pilots to work the ramp before getting a right seat. We think that exploits peoples passion and desire to fly. This program would be for student pilots only. After getting their licences, they would have to leave to get the desired experience before applying to be a pilot. The other benefit for us is that in our home base therer are plenty of jobs around and ramp work is just plain hard, so despite a competitive wage and great benefits there is a huge turnover on the ramp, and some guys don't quite understand the subtleties of working around airliners (as Alaska also knows). Student pilots tend to respect aircraft and with the knowledge of possible future employment be a little more likely to perform and work to the end of their term (maybe 6mo or a year, at the same wage as the other rampies).
As I mentioned in the last post, the student pilot gets a part time job with shifts that compliment their training schedules. They get experience in aviation to put on their resume. They get a reference inside the company for consideration when they apply to be a pilot with us (of course a good reference from the ramp supervisor would be what helps). While working for us on the ramp they would be expected to conduct at least a couple of fam flights in the jumpseat and sit in on a simulator session with a line crew (LOFT) to see what line flying and training is like and if they actually want to work in this profession.
The final benefit is for both. If they do come back as a pilot, they have seen both sides of airside ops and are far less likely to have Flight Deck Primma Donna Syndrome.
Now with a few more details, let me know what you think. Tell any buddies who are also student pilots to see this post and add comments. You could PM me if it gets too busy on here.
I'd make it a poll but i'm not sure if we can post a poll on this site.
One of the issues airlines have, or any employer for that matter, is how to get an understanding of a person's attitude and work ethic. Sure you can check for prangs and violations, and a SIM check will generally tell if they can keep the blue side up. But a picture of what a person is like to work with is a bit harder to make. Personal and employer references have limitations. Some guys will talk up a pilot just cause they're a buddy, or diss them cause they wouldn't do a shift trade at the old company or dated the cute F/A that they were after. Same with employers, blow sunshine cause they want to get rid of the guy or diss him/her because they wouldn't bust minimums or clean the boss' pool.
But if the applicant has already worked for you, the employer should have a very clear picture of what that worker is like. Then its just a case of the pilot aquiring the skills and experience needed. Also, the pilot applicant already knows the company, how it works, the politics, pay etc.. so if they still apply, they know what they are getting into.
One of the things we do NOT want to ever do is require pilots to work the ramp before getting a right seat. We think that exploits peoples passion and desire to fly. This program would be for student pilots only. After getting their licences, they would have to leave to get the desired experience before applying to be a pilot. The other benefit for us is that in our home base therer are plenty of jobs around and ramp work is just plain hard, so despite a competitive wage and great benefits there is a huge turnover on the ramp, and some guys don't quite understand the subtleties of working around airliners (as Alaska also knows). Student pilots tend to respect aircraft and with the knowledge of possible future employment be a little more likely to perform and work to the end of their term (maybe 6mo or a year, at the same wage as the other rampies).
As I mentioned in the last post, the student pilot gets a part time job with shifts that compliment their training schedules. They get experience in aviation to put on their resume. They get a reference inside the company for consideration when they apply to be a pilot with us (of course a good reference from the ramp supervisor would be what helps). While working for us on the ramp they would be expected to conduct at least a couple of fam flights in the jumpseat and sit in on a simulator session with a line crew (LOFT) to see what line flying and training is like and if they actually want to work in this profession.
The final benefit is for both. If they do come back as a pilot, they have seen both sides of airside ops and are far less likely to have Flight Deck Primma Donna Syndrome.
Now with a few more details, let me know what you think. Tell any buddies who are also student pilots to see this post and add comments. You could PM me if it gets too busy on here.
Last edited by wrc on Tue Jan 10, 2006 7:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Yes they would have to leave the company. There would be NO easing of experience requirements. If they do return, its becouse they want to work here. The only incentive is an internal refernce with the airline from their supervisor. Its just a part time job to help cover the high cost of training.The only thing is an employee would be leaving the company (ramp job) to get the flying experience before being hired back as a pilot at a later date. A pilot may not return unless some sort of incentive was given. The incentive would not have to be much, but being hired with less hours that a non-employee is what I'm thinking.
Thats actually another concern we have. That only people from affluent families can afford the training. especially true if you have to move from a small town to get the training. We're afraid some potentially great pilots will never get a chance to be pilots. That said, the North American airline industry cannot afford and will not start Pilot Cadet programs such as those seen in Europe and Asia.
