The UnVaxxed Overflow Hospitals

[altiplano]

At AdventHealth Shawnee Mission, a hospital near Kansas City, Missouri, chief medical officer Dr. Lisa Hays said the emergency department is experiencing backups sometimes lasting for days.

“The beds are not the issue. It’s the nurses to staff the beds. ... And it’s all created by rising COVID numbers and burnout," Hays said. “Our nurses are burnt out.”

Is she lying then Anti Vaxers? Yes or no?

Wrong question - the question is what is her motivation, what is her bias.

Recent Google review of AdventHealth Shawnee Mission says the patient was in the ER with a cut and stitched up in 45 minutes... hardly a days long ER waits.

Also, what's the greater motivation of the article itself? Isolated and anecdotal quotes from a few people are not news. They are picked, probably not in context, to stoke a response, a feeling in broader society.

My friends and family in healthcare just shrug when I ask about this stuff... what pieces like this portray are not reflected in reality as the statistic posted above shows.

[photofly]

Photofly, how much Covid spread am I personally responsible for? How many deaths?

Statistically, more than if you were vaccinated.

Take your outrage somewhere else.

I’m not outraged. That’s you inventing thoughts you would like me to have in my head, so you can decry them. I’m actually puzzled and curious.

Funny how you were all so proud of the consequences for the non vax… some of you even mock the unvaccinated.but as soon as they shrug their shoulders and say fine, I accept the restrictions

But they (you) don’t accept the risks and the costs, which we will pay for you.

[imjustlurking]

Photofly, how much Covid spread am I personally responsible for? How many deaths?

Statistically, more than if you were vaccinated.

Take your outrage somewhere else.

I’m not outraged. That’s you inventing thoughts you would like me to have in my head, so you can decry them. I’m actually puzzled and curious.

Funny how you were all so proud of the consequences for the non vax… some of you even mock the unvaccinated.but as soon as they shrug their shoulders and say fine, I accept the restrictions

But they (you) don’t accept the risks and the costs, which we will pay for you.

It's annoy arguing with these people, eh?

Altiplano tries to annoy me by calling me a telemarketer because I worked as a call center agent for the Provincial Vaccine Contact Centre as my COVID job.

Others go around saying I'm not a pilot. I don't know why that would or should upset me. I'd be much more comfortable writing this reply from my own home instead of a random hotel.

Antivaxxers have run out of half-sensible arguments and are now working with fallacies. It's best to remind them that they're stupid and get on with your day.

[altiplano]

You talk in circles.

It was pointed out above, all the incremental restrictions starting from 2 weeks and on down to where we are today.

Vaccinated are responsible for spread, that's why they are dialing them down, instituting more shots, and you don't acknowledge that You just take it hook line and sinker and look to place blame on people that didn't follow what you have chosen for yourself but, as CYER pointed out, are following the rules.

You're a hysteric, pointing fingers, casting blame, it makes you feel good... you're on a pilot forum, you aren't a pilot, did I see you're a crew scheduler or something? No matter, you comment on everything looking for your morning dopamine hit by reciting the popular opinion.

Midwit doesn't even begin to describe your case.

[CYERCaptainPooping]

But they (you) don’t accept the risks and the costs, which we will pay for you.

Remember, I'm just a dummy. I have mitigated the risks and the costs because I have consequences for not being vaccinated, and like a dummy that I am I am following the guidelines and policy of our government. I have a choice to get vaccinated right? If I am given the choice then whats your problem? You are paying the same for the vaccinated people who still end up in hospital and still spread covid. Vaccinated people have more freedoms, so they could very well spread covid in settings where non vaccinated are not allowed. Thousands of vaccinated people are boarding planes where non vaccinated can't. If you don't like the policy, speak up... if you are the expert, let us know. What should the policy be? This is not the pandemic of the non vaccinated, its the pandemic of government policy. (should policy be more strict? should we change it?)

I think what you are saying is you don't accept the leadership and experts restrictions on the non vaccinated. is this the issue?

One things for certain, if you take away a non vaccinated persons employment, you definitely will be paying for them. They have no income, and don't pay taxes. But I didn't make this policy. I didn't support it, advocate for it, I don't even think its good policy. So yes you will be the one paying for everything that our taxes fund, but that's what the experts said needs to be done to solve the pandemic. Maybe you know better.

[CYERCaptainPooping]

Antivaxxers have run out of half-sensible arguments and are now working with fallacies. It's best to remind them that they're stupid and get on with your day.

Pretty sure a month ago you were the one who said "you have a choice! but your choice has consequences"

Uh okay, So when someone makes a choice, and accepts the consequences, then whats your problem? Are you outraged when people accept the consequences? Are you not happy until someone else is unhappy?

Ironic how you really pushed that "You have a choice! It's not mandatory!" But you still have an issue. Now you are outraged about giving the choice. Go get therapy.

[imjustlurking]

You talk in circles.

It was pointed out above, all the incremental restrictions starting from 2 weeks and on down to where we are today.

Vaccinated are responsible for spread, that's why they are dialing them down, instituting more shots, and you don't acknowledge that You just take it hook line and sinker and look to place blame on people that didn't follow what you have chosen for yourself but, as CYER pointed out, are following the rules.

You're a hysteric, pointing fingers, casting blame, it makes you feel good... you're on a pilot forum, you aren't a pilot, did I see you're a crew scheduler or something? No matter, you comment on everything looking for your morning dopamine hit by reciting the popular opinion.

Midwit doesn't even begin to describe your case.

I'd like to see your source on that. Every time I check, all I see is that the case numbers and hospitalization numbers have not fully-vaccinated people grossly over representing the population versus fully vaccinated people.

https://covid19-sciencetable.ca/ontario-dashboard/

And again, I don't care whether any of you think I am a pilot or not. I'm not sure how many times I will have to repeat that before you realize that being a pilot does not define me, nor does the idea of not being a pilot seem like an insult to me.

[Vaticinator]

But they can only be wrong in a world where individuals have some responsibility to act outside of following the rules. In the world where the individual (that's you, by the way) has no responsibility to their fellows, the state has no responsibility to do the right thing by them - it's just rules, after all.

Every person fulfills their responsibility to their fellow citizens' health care when the government takes their money in the form of taxes that go to pay for our socialized health care. Anything beyond this is a courtesy and cannot be demanded. Paying those taxes allows anyone access to that socialized health care regardless of their personal health choices. That's why smokers get to continue their suicidal habit without having to waive their right to medical care when they ultimately end up with lung cancer. It's why obese people can keep slowly killing themselves with their lack of willpower and discipline, while knowing that medical professionals will rush to their aid to restart their clogged heart when it quits on them. It sure would be courteous of smokers, and drinkers, and drug abusers, and fat people to change their behaviours for the rest of us, but we cannot demand it. Their personal choices drain the system of resources and finances and we've all decided that that is ok, even though it affects all of us to varying degrees. That is the system we've all either agreed upon or been born into. A system that is supposed to be set up with excess capacity to accommodate extraordinary circumstances such as viral outbreaks. Now, in a situation when the burden on those resources is heavy, the government has implemented a duality of mitigation strategies that an individual can choose from. Get vaccinated and live "unrestricted", or don't get vaccinated and live with limited access to society and possibly give up your career. THESE ARE the government sanctioned ways in which we all get to choose to go above and beyond our basic responsibilities to each other, and help our fellow man.

So I'll ask again. If the government in your province said it was now necessary to refuse hospital, ICU or ventilator treatment for COVID for unvaccinated individuals, and, with regret, they would be left to die if necessary, would that induce you to get vaccinated?

Just because someone chooses one of the two risk mitigation options you don't agree with, does not mean that you then get to remove their access to the health care system that they pay for. That is an emotional over-reaction and would be you failing your duty to your fellow citizen under the system in place which allows for anyone to make any poor health decision they want, with no restriction to their access to care.

That being said:

Think of this as an opportunity to demonstrate the strength of your commitment to anyone reading this thread.

I'm actually on board with this restricting of health care access, so long as it's applied evenly across the board to all known negative health choices. Does your commitment to this idea run deep enough to cut off smokers, drinkers, drug abusers and overweight people from health care access because they are making scientifically proven bad choices? As a person who takes their health very seriously and also pays a lot of taxes that I'd rather not, I'll happily play this game of chicken with you. Health care only for natural causes and acts of god. Agreed? I won't even ask for a refund for all of my tax dollars that will be freed up by this arrangement. Maybe it could go to teaching skepticism and critical thinking in schools.

Photofly, how much Covid spread am I personally responsible for? How many deaths?

Statistically, more than if you were vaccinated.

True. But in absolute terms, with the data we have on vaccinated transmission rates and breakthrough infections etc, if all the remaining holdouts in this country got vaccinated, the risk reduction to currently vaccinated individuals on a personal level is in the thousandths of a percent for the average Canadian under 80. With the current vaccination rates, being vaccinated and living a healthy lifestyle are the only two options that offer any real tangible protection. Relying on anyone or everyone else to get vaccinated for protection is a mathematical pipe dream and a dangerous one at that, as it shifts the focus off of personal responsibility for your own health and places it on to strangers.

Antivaxxers have run out of half-sensible arguments and are now working with fallacies. It's best to remind them that they're stupid and get on with your day.

You're calling out people for "half-sensible arguments" while your argument is literally, "You're stupid"? If you're truly invested in convincing people to get vaccinated, you should consider keeping your mouth shut. I know toddlers that could form more compelling thoughts on this topic.

[CYERCaptainPooping]

I'd like to see your source on that. Every time I check, all I see is that the case numbers and hospitalization numbers have not fully-vaccinated people grossly over representing the population versus fully vaccinated people.

That is not evidence that vaccinated people don't spread covid. We knew the vaccinated spread covid the day the Dr. Fauci said the vaccinated people should still wear masks because they still spread covid. We have known this since the summer. And further, with the new variant its is likely the vaccinated are now spreading more covid than ever as this is more transmissible and the current vaccine was not built off the current strain. The vaccines are less effective today than when they were first studied because of the variations of the virus. However they are saying the vaccines are still effective to reduce deaths and hospitalizations with the new variant.

Why would anyone accept any restrictions against vaccinated people if they don't spread covid. If the vaccinated didn't spread covid I would think the pandemic would be over. It just doesn't seem logical to me that 10 percent of the population would be responsible for the spread. I might agree if you said vaccinated are less likely to spread covid, but then again I don't believe that because the vaccinated have more freedoms that allow them to expose other people. Net result is such that its seems clear to me the vaccinated a responsible for lots of covid spread. All people traveling by plane and train are vaccinated, this means all cases contracted at airports is 100 percent from vaccinated people. And if they didn't spread covid there would be zero reason to restrict travel for vaccinated people.

And I just want to point out something with my understanding of what a vaccine does. A vaccine protects the person who takes it. A vaccine is not designed to protect others around you. If it does, Great! but unfortunately that's not how vaccines work by design, its not like the masking religion thinking. When they do vaccine efficacy study, its never a study of how much it reduces transmission to other people. The study answers if its safe, and effective at reducing infection in the person who take the shot. Unless you have seen something different in the vaccine trials??? Maybe the experts told us that to guilt everyone into getting the shot. This way we could take 6 year olds and say, "get your vax so you can be a superhero!" Because we know kids ever extremely low risk. So really this is just cult like thinking IMO. Fucking scary the radio ads about kids being super heros for taking shots.

[photofly]

I'd like to see your source on that. Every time I check, all I see is that the case numbers and hospitalization numbers have not fully-vaccinated people grossly over representing the population versus fully vaccinated people.

That is not evidence that vaccinated people don't spread covid. We knew the vaccinated spread covid the day the Dr. Fauci said the vaccinated people should still wear masks because they still spread covid. We have known this since the summer. And further, with the new variant its is likely the vaccinated are now spreading more covid than ever as this is more transmissible and the current vaccine was not built off the current strain. The vaccines are less effective today than when they were first studied because of the variations of the virus. However they are saying the vaccines are still effective to reduce deaths and hospitalizations with the new variant.

Why would anyone accept any restrictions against vaccinated people if they don't spread covid.

Because they are much more likely to spread it than vaccinated people.

[CYERCaptainPooping]

I'd like to see your source on that. Every time I check, all I see is that the case numbers and hospitalization numbers have not fully-vaccinated people grossly over representing the population versus fully vaccinated people.

That is not evidence that vaccinated people don't spread covid. We knew the vaccinated spread covid the day the Dr. Fauci said the vaccinated people should still wear masks because they still spread covid. We have known this since the summer. And further, with the new variant its is likely the vaccinated are now spreading more covid than ever as this is more transmissible and the current vaccine was not built off the current strain. The vaccines are less effective today than when they were first studied because of the variations of the virus. However they are saying the vaccines are still effective to reduce deaths and hospitalizations with the new variant.

Why would anyone accept any restrictions against vaccinated people if they don't spread covid.

Because they are much more likely to spread it than vaccinated people.

I think you are speaking anecdotes and not science. Ontario had over 3700 cases today and 2700 of them are fully vaccinated. Are you telling me those 2700 vaccinated people got the virus most likely from a non vaccinated person? Are you also saying those 2700 people are not likely to infect anyone else. I really don't know the specifics of the science but if I had to make a guess I would think "much more likely" is a huge stretch. The reasons restrictions are coming down on the vaccinated is because the science must be showing that the vaccinated are responsible for a substantial amount of spread. And if they are not, these restrictions are absolutely egregious. Punishing vaccinated people, if they are not spreading covid is so counterintuitive if your beliefs are true, for two reasons. Reason 1, you are punishing people for no good reason if they are not spreading covid (and its the group of people who specifically followed your recommendations), reason 2, the unvaxxinated are watching and the message is saying vaccines are not working at stopping the spread when we were told it does. Its actually outrageous to think vaccines prevent spread by a factor of "much more likely" and that the restrictions coming down go completely against science, sounds like a conspiracy.

I think its time to reset, scrap what we thought we knew... let go of old ideas and look at some things objectively. We don't need to hold on to old thoughts just to be right about it. Do vaccines protect the people who take them. Absolutely. Do they prevent transmission, especially with the new variant that is more transmissible. It appears it is lacking efficacy at preventing transmission.

[altiplano]

You talk in circles.

It was pointed out above, all the incremental restrictions starting from 2 weeks and on down to where we are today.

Vaccinated are responsible for spread, that's why they are dialing them down, instituting more shots, and you don't acknowledge that You just take it hook line and sinker and look to place blame on people that didn't follow what you have chosen for yourself but, as CYER pointed out, are following the rules.

You're a hysteric, pointing fingers, casting blame, it makes you feel good... you're on a pilot forum, you aren't a pilot, did I see you're a crew scheduler or something? No matter, you comment on everything looking for your morning dopamine hit by reciting the popular opinion.

Midwit doesn't even begin to describe your case.

I'd like to see your source on that. Every time I check, all I see is that the case numbers and hospitalization numbers have not fully-vaccinated people grossly over representing the population versus fully vaccinated people.

https://covid19-sciencetable.ca/ontario-dashboard/

And again, I don't care whether any of you think I am a pilot or not. I'm not sure how many times I will have to repeat that before you realize that being a pilot does not define me, nor does the idea of not being a pilot seem like an insult to me.

Ontario science table are a bunch of self important, self appointed, self promoting academics that want to get on CBC and make comments on the evening news. They have no official capacity and have been doomsday projection spreaders for the duration of this.

And look into what they constitute as a case. It differs between the two which is interesting.

Vaccinated contract and spread sarscov2 - that's a fact, vaccines don't make you immune.

Why else would they reduce restaurant capacity? Those are only vaccinated people.

Why else would they seek to impose more flight restrictions and travel bans? Those are all vaccinated people.

Why else would they call for boosters? In already vaccinated people.

E81BE61B-F2D7-47BF-B27B-CF657137D11F.png (1022.42 KiB) Viewed 954 times

[imjustlurking]

Antivaxxers have run out of half-sensible arguments and are now working with fallacies. It's best to remind them that they're stupid and get on with your day.

You're calling out people for "half-sensible arguments" while your argument is literally, "You're stupid"? If you're truly invested in convincing people to get vaccinated, you should consider keeping your mouth shut. I know toddlers that could form more compelling thoughts on this topic.

I did my part to help those who want to get vaccinated book their appointments. I am not interested in debating with those who are too stupid or stubborn to accept the facts.

I'd like to see your source on that. Every time I check, all I see is that the case numbers and hospitalization numbers have not fully-vaccinated people grossly over representing the population versus fully vaccinated people.

That is not evidence that vaccinated people don't spread covid. We knew the vaccinated spread covid the day the Dr. Fauci said the vaccinated people should still wear masks because they still spread covid. We have known this since the summer. And further, with the new variant its is likely the vaccinated are now spreading more covid than ever as this is more transmissible and the current vaccine was not built off the current strain. The vaccines are less effective today than when they were first studied because of the variations of the virus. However they are saying the vaccines are still effective to reduce deaths and hospitalizations with the new variant.

You are correct. The vaccine does not stop you from being infected, nor does it prevent you from being contagious and spreading it.

What the vaccine does, in simple terms, is reduce the risk significantly of being hospitalized and taking resources that are desperately needed elsewhere. I have been very clear with this fact many times.

Fully vaxxed people can still contract and transmit COVID-19.

A vaccine does not prevent you from getting sick, but it gives your body a serious head start on fighting the virus before you get too sick.

It's like how having headlights won't stop you from hitting a deer at night, but you'll have enough time to slow down or even stop.

I have said it before and I'll say it again because too many people don't understand what a vaccine is or what it does.

Vaccines allow the body to create an antibody response before being infected with a virus for the first time. It's like being instructed in the simulator before jumping into the real plane.

The vaccine does not prevent you from being infected, just as sim time does not mean that you will not crash when you first get into the real plane.

The vaccine allows your body a head start in learning how to identify a pathogen and produce an antibody response. It's similar to how after having some simulator time, you will have a better understanding of the aircraft when you first step foot into it.

Long story short, just like sim time, a vaccine reduces the duration of the initial phase of an infection. The result is that your body has a head start on fighting the pathogen and preventing it from multiplying.

Now, imagine you are getting old and/or have immune deficiencies. Compare that to having poor motor control of your limbs. You are already at a deficit and are still more likely to crash the plane (or get seriously ill or die from a pathogen). Having a severely compromised immune system is like having no control of your arms or legs whatsoever. No matter how much sim time or vaccine you get, you are fucked.

So, you may ask, why get the vaccine or practice in the simulator? Neither of them prevent you from dying/crashing. When it comes down to it, it's not about a black and white, 0 and 1, true or false... it's about reducing risk.

[imjustlurking]

You talk in circles.

It was pointed out above, all the incremental restrictions starting from 2 weeks and on down to where we are today.

Vaccinated are responsible for spread, that's why they are dialing them down, instituting more shots, and you don't acknowledge that You just take it hook line and sinker and look to place blame on people that didn't follow what you have chosen for yourself but, as CYER pointed out, are following the rules.

You're a hysteric, pointing fingers, casting blame, it makes you feel good... you're on a pilot forum, you aren't a pilot, did I see you're a crew scheduler or something? No matter, you comment on everything looking for your morning dopamine hit by reciting the popular opinion.

Midwit doesn't even begin to describe your case.

I'd like to see your source on that. Every time I check, all I see is that the case numbers and hospitalization numbers have not fully-vaccinated people grossly over representing the population versus fully vaccinated people.

https://covid19-sciencetable.ca/ontario-dashboard/

And again, I don't care whether any of you think I am a pilot or not. I'm not sure how many times I will have to repeat that before you realize that being a pilot does not define me, nor does the idea of not being a pilot seem like an insult to me.

Ontario science table are a bunch of self important, self appointed, self promoting academics that want to get on CBC and make comments on the evening news. They have no official capacity and have been doomsday projection spreaders for the duration of this.

And look into what they constitute as a case. It differs between the two which is interesting.

Vaccinated contract and spread sarscov2 - that's a fact, vaccines don't make you immune.

Why else would they reduce restaurant capacity? Those are only vaccinated people.

Why else would they seek to impose more flight restrictions and travel bans? Those are all vaccinated people.

Why else would they call for boosters? In already vaccinated people.

E81BE61B-F2D7-47BF-B27B-CF657137D11F.png

The little respect I have for you tells me that I should remind you that you are an idiot and implore you to take a break from the internet.

[RRJetPilot]

But he is right.

The Vaxed spread covid just as much as the unvaxed, just for a shorter period of time. On average 5.5 days vs 7.5 days. I know Its hard to believe. I didnt want to believe it either. We are just as "unclean" as the unvaxed lol.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/diseases ... oronavirus

"An analysis of the viral samples revealed that the amount of virus produced, even at the peak of infection, was similar regardless of which variant the participant was infected with. Viral load also did not vary much by vaccination status.

However, participants with breakthrough infections cleared their infections more quickly — in an average of 5.5 days, compared to 7.5 days — than people who were unvaccinated. Faster clearance translates to a shorter period of contagiousness, reducing the opportunity for someone with a breakthrough infection to spread the virus."

[altiplano]

The little respect I have for you tells me that I should remind you that you are an idiot and implore you to take a break from the internet.

And that's all you got. Insults... again and again when you don't get the hit you're looking for from people agreeing with you you go straight to insults.

If that's what you have to contribute maybe you should take your own advice?

Or go take that trip to Florida you were talking about. That would be great.

[imjustlurking]

The little respect I have for you tells me that I should remind you that you are an idiot and implore you to take a break from the internet.

And that's all you got. Insults... again and again when you don't get the hit you're looking for from people agreeing with you you go straight to insults.

If that's what you have to contribute maybe you should take your own advice?

Or go take that trip to Florida you were talking about. That would be great.

Had you actually read the post above the one you're replying to, you would have seen this:

Antivaxxers have run out of half-sensible arguments and are now working with fallacies. It's best to remind them that they're stupid and get on with your day.

You're calling out people for "half-sensible arguments" while your argument is literally, "You're stupid"? If you're truly invested in convincing people to get vaccinated, you should consider keeping your mouth shut. I know toddlers that could form more compelling thoughts on this topic.

I did my part to help those who want to get vaccinated book their appointments. I am not interested in debating with those who are too stupid or stubborn to accept the facts.

I'd like to see your source on that. Every time I check, all I see is that the case numbers and hospitalization numbers have not fully-vaccinated people grossly over representing the population versus fully vaccinated people.

That is not evidence that vaccinated people don't spread covid. We knew the vaccinated spread covid the day the Dr. Fauci said the vaccinated people should still wear masks because they still spread covid. We have known this since the summer. And further, with the new variant its is likely the vaccinated are now spreading more covid than ever as this is more transmissible and the current vaccine was not built off the current strain. The vaccines are less effective today than when they were first studied because of the variations of the virus. However they are saying the vaccines are still effective to reduce deaths and hospitalizations with the new variant.

You are correct. The vaccine does not stop you from being infected, nor does it prevent you from being contagious and spreading it.

What the vaccine does, in simple terms, is reduce the risk significantly of being hospitalized and taking resources that are desperately needed elsewhere. I have been very clear with this fact many times.

Fully vaxxed people can still contract and transmit COVID-19.

A vaccine does not prevent you from getting sick, but it gives your body a serious head start on fighting the virus before you get too sick.

It's like how having headlights won't stop you from hitting a deer at night, but you'll have enough time to slow down or even stop.

I have said it before and I'll say it again because too many people don't understand what a vaccine is or what it does.

Vaccines allow the body to create an antibody response before being infected with a virus for the first time. It's like being instructed in the simulator before jumping into the real plane.

The vaccine does not prevent you from being infected, just as sim time does not mean that you will not crash when you first get into the real plane.

The vaccine allows your body a head start in learning how to identify a pathogen and produce an antibody response. It's similar to how after having some simulator time, you will have a better understanding of the aircraft when you first step foot into it.

Long story short, just like sim time, a vaccine reduces the duration of the initial phase of an infection. The result is that your body has a head start on fighting the pathogen and preventing it from multiplying.

Now, imagine you are getting old and/or have immune deficiencies. Compare that to having poor motor control of your limbs. You are already at a deficit and are still more likely to crash the plane (or get seriously ill or die from a pathogen). Having a severely compromised immune system is like having no control of your arms or legs whatsoever. No matter how much sim time or vaccine you get, you are fucked.

So, you may ask, why get the vaccine or practice in the simulator? Neither of them prevent you from dying/crashing. When it comes down to it, it's not about a black and white, 0 and 1, true or false... it's about reducing risk.

[Vaticinator]

I am not interested in debating with those who are too stupid or stubborn to accept the facts.

Your heavy presence in this sub forum would suggest otherwise, light on "facts" though it may be.

[CYERCaptainPooping]

20C64558-7AD2-4088-BDF3-C26044B4D87C.jpeg (487.65 KiB) Viewed 816 times

[altiplano]

The little respect I have for you tells me that I should remind you that you are an idiot and implore you to take a break from the internet.

And that's all you got. Insults... again and again when you don't get the hit you're looking for from people agreeing with you you go straight to insults.

If that's what you have to contribute maybe you should take your own advice?

Or go take that trip to Florida you were talking about. That would be great.

Had you actually read the post above the one you're replying to, you would have seen this:

So now you're acknowledging that vaccinated peoples spread sarscov2.

So why were you denying my statement and then insulting me?

Go to Florida, go anywhere out of your bubble, and get some broader perspective on life and reality.