Should COVID boosters be mandatory for the aviation sector ?

[Vaticinator]

Why not? You're entitled to pretend that if people aren't compelled to be vaccinated that old people will most certainly die in spite of the fact that in reality, the probability is far closer to nothing bad happening at all. I'm just choosing to live in the most probable version of reality. Either way, it doesn't matter. You'll likely get your way. I'm fairly confident we'll all be getting many, many boosters.

[Vaticinator]

Telling a 20 year old unvaccinated couple that they can't go out to dinner does NOTHING to protect an octogenarian in a care home

This pretence from you that it's "all or nothing" and if it's not everything, it can't be anything, is tedious.

You're correct. I should not have said "nothing." That was a poor choice of words. I'm sure mathematically speaking it does offer some level of protection, probably in the order of sub-thousandths of a percent. "Effectively nothing" would have been more accurate.

[photofly]

Telling a 20 year old unvaccinated couple that they can't go out to dinner does NOTHING to protect an octogenarian in a care home

This pretence from you that it's "all or nothing" and if it's not everything, it can't be anything, is tedious.

You're correct. I should not have said "nothing." That was a poor choice of words. I'm sure mathematically speaking it does offer some level of protection, probably in the order of sub-thousandths of a percent. "Effectively nothing" would have been more accurate.

If you want people to respond to your arguments, they can only respond to the words that you do use, not the words you should have used.

But even had you said "effectively nothing" you would still be plainly and clearly wrong.

[Vaticinator]

Prove it using data and not anecdotes. I'll wait.

[photofly]

How do you think COVID 19 is spread? Faries? Do you think it could it just possibly might have something to do with people in badly venitlated closed rooms close together, without masks on, like, uh, in restaurants?

No?

How then?

Pixies?

Cosmic rays?

Too much sunlight?

How do you catch COVID? How?

[CYERCaptainPooping]

Wow. Photofly is completely invested in the moral narrative.

Do you also believe in being embarrassed if you get Covid? Do you get embarrassed if you get cancer or other diseases?

Shame on anyone who gets Covid right? they behaved carelessly.

[photofly]

Wow. Photofly is completely invested in the moral narrative.

Do you also believe in being embarrassed if you get Covid? Do you get embarrassed if you get cancer or other diseases?

This discussion has nothing to do with morals or embarrassment. It's a simple question of whether stopping people from dining out protects others from COVID. And it does. Because it reduces infection opportunities.

The fact that *you* want it to have something to do with morals, and that *you* raise the question of embarrassment, reveals how *you* feel about things.

You're the one who wants clear-cut rules, and not letting unvaccinated people dine out seems to be a clear cut rule that reduces infection all round.

However, to answer your question: if I was unvaccinated and I dined out, and contracted COVID, which then spread from me to a retirement home causing the death of several elderly people, then, yes, I'd feel pretty shitty about my decision-making. Wouldn't you?

[CYERCaptainPooping]

Wow. Photofly is completely invested in the moral narrative.

Do you also believe in being embarrassed if you get Covid? Do you get embarrassed if you get cancer or other diseases?

It has nothing to do with morals or embarrassment. It's a simple question of whether stopping people from dining out protects others from COVID. And it does. Because it reduces infection opportunities.

The fact that *you* want it to have something to do with morals, or raise the question embarrassment, reveals how *you* feel about things.

You literally speak the moral narrative. Blame the antivax, same on the young who don’t protect the old. Nothing scientific. You are the one who sees covid as a moral issue. I think I know exactly how you think because I have seen people go through it. One family member gets Covid, then they say “x” family member is going to be so mad at me because I ruined things and may have transmitted it to them, now they have to quarantine. In their head it’s a huge mortal thing, they literally shame their family and friends who get Covid.

My response in these conversations is how utterly ridiculous it is to blame shame or get mad at someone who gets Covid. I like to think I have a rational stance in Covid. Stats, facts.

Of course it can be difficult to remain rational. If I had family die of Covid it would be very easy to make covod a moral, or emotional response issue. But that doesn’t change the science. I do my best to think what is right for the greater good. A great start is begin with core values and principles… destroying careers for literally no mitigation of Covid risk is absolutely terrible. How many lives have been saved by laying off non vax pilots in Canada, give us the figure.

How much transmission will you stop if we mandate boosters? We already have these answers, statistically insignificant. The booster only protects the person who takes it. To what degree is up to interpretation. The vax manufacturers are absolutely over representing the vale of their products.

[photofly]

Wow. Photofly is completely invested in the moral narrative.

Do you also believe in being embarrassed if you get Covid? Do you get embarrassed if you get cancer or other diseases?

It has nothing to do with morals or embarrassment. It's a simple question of whether stopping people from dining out protects others from COVID. And it does. Because it reduces infection opportunities.

The fact that *you* want it to have something to do with morals, or raise the question embarrassment, reveals how *you* feel about things.

You literally speak the moral narrative. Blame the antivax, same on the young who don’t protect the old. Nothing scientific. You are the one who sees covid as a moral issue. I think I know exactly how you think because I have seen people go through it. One family member gets Covid, then they say “x” family member is going to be so mad at me because I ruined things and may have transmitted it to them, now they have to quarantine. In their head it’s a huge mortal thing, they literally shame their family and friends who get Covid.

My response in these conversations is how utterly ridiculous it is to blame shame or get mad at someone who gets Covid. I like to think I have a rational stance in Covid. Stats, facts.

Of course it can be difficult to remain rational. If I had family die of Covid it would be very easy to make covod a moral, or emotional response issue. But that doesn’t change the science. I do my best to think what is right for the greater good. A great start is begin with core values and principles… destroying careers for literally no mitigation of Covid risk is absolutely terrible. How many lives have been saved by laying off non vax pilots in Canada, give us the figure.

Isn't spreading COVID because you refuse to get vaccinated like spreading STIs because you refuse to wear a condom?

[photofly]

I do my best to think what is right for the greater good.

The greater good is for you to get vaccinated.

[CYERCaptainPooping]

Well photofly you are wrong.
A moral argument doesn’t change science.

Should all 5 year olds have to get vaccinated?

What does your moral argument say.

[photofly]

Well photofly you are wrong.
A moral argument doesn’t change science.

The argument is only moral because of the science. You're less likely to spread the disease if you're vaccinated, which is what makes it the moral choice.

[CYERCaptainPooping]

Well photofly you are wrong.
A moral argument doesn’t change science.

The argument is only moral because of the science. You're less likely to spread the disease if you're vaccinated, which is what makes it the moral choice.

That’s more miss information

By how much would you say your statement is true? Is it even 25 percent accurate?

Should 5 year olds have to get vax to prevent spread even with at extreme low risk to the disease?

The ads for the vax literally say they don’t prevent contracting Covid and spreading Covid. You literally make statements against what the drug manufacturers say.

[photofly]

Well photofly you are wrong.
A moral argument doesn’t change science.

The argument is only moral because of the science. You're less likely to spread the disease if you're vaccinated, which is what makes it the moral choice.

That’s more miss information

By how much would you say your statement is true? Is it even 25 percent accurate?

Until the recent omicron variant, it was true by factors of several. It appears to make less of a difference with the omicron variant; but the numbers and science have always been irrelevant to you. To you it has never seemed a moral choice, and you were making the same claims of vaccine ineffectiveness and amorality when delta was the biggest issue.

If you're prepared to stick to your guns for long enough, the pandemic will be over and vaccine restrictions will be a thing of the past. At that time you can tell everyone who will listen that you were right all along and science has finally acknowledged what you've known (falsely) to be true since day one, that vaccines aren't any use, and nobody should ever have had to take one.

[CYERCaptainPooping]

The argument is only moral because of the science. You're less likely to spread the disease if you're vaccinated, which is what makes it the moral choice.

That’s more miss information

By how much would you say your statement is true? Is it even 25 percent accurate?

Until the recent omicron variant, it was true by factors of several. It appears to make less of a difference with the omicron variant; but the numbers and science have always been irrelevant to you. To you it has never seemed a moral choice, and you were making the same claims of vaccine ineffectiveness and amorality when delta was the biggest issue.

Again more lies. You are assuming because delta spread less that you must be right. You are so committed to your lies.

And if you were right, since the booster is for alpha variant still, it should not be mandatory. It’s not even a vaccine designed for omicron, and not proving to be effective at all these claims you make.

[photofly]

And if you were right, since the booster is for alpha variant still, it should not be mandatory. It’s not even a vaccine designed for omicron, and not proving to be effective at all these claims you make.

The booster is a half dose of a vaccine originally designed around the original virus. It doesn't need to be designed around a particular variant, and it's proving to be effective at keeping people out of hospital, and out of ICU, particularly. At this stage, having a vaccine booster isn't mandatory, nor is it mandatory to have a vaccine at all. It remains your choice.

Like I said, if you wait long enough, until the pandemic is over, and there are no more vaccine restrictions, you will be able smugly, but wrongly, to claim to have been right all along.

[Inverted2]

4th shot for the old folks and forced boosters for nursing home staff. I wonder how short staffed they’ll be after this? I know one nurse that’s gonna walk because of this and she’s not alone.

https://www.cp24.com/mobile/news/ontari ... -1.5723636

[CYERCaptainPooping]

Just remember we were hitting night vaccinated in the off season for Covid. The summer is no evidence for vaccine efficacy. You assume because summer has low cases the vaccines were fantastic.

Had we vaccinated for delta in September 2020 I’ll bet it would have been a much different picture.

You still refuse to answer if 5 year olds need to be vaccinated for your “moral” opinion… what’s the answer? Where do you draw the line?

Anyways best to you. I see giving people the boot from work as astronomically more immoral than their decision to not get vaccinated. Sincerely sorry for those who lost their jobs and I find it disgusting people encourage that. Especially with hindsight today where we know it was a huge fail. One could argue we were trying our best (best science at the time bs argument we keep hearing), but it is obvious today it was a fail. I really don’t think booster will get mandated for that reason. More people will walk off the job. They have had enough.

[photofly]

Anyways best to you. I see giving people the boot from work as astronomically more immoral than their decision to not get vaccinated.

I don't.

[Vaticinator]

This discussion has nothing to do with morals or embarrassment.

It has everything to do with morals. The perceived moral high ground has been the crux of the pro mandate crowd from day 1. Remember all that "greater good" stuff about how 38.2 million of us are supposed to be altruistic and get the jab to protect the 1.4 million octogenarians and keep the hospitals empty?

It's a simple question of whether stopping people from dining out protects others from COVID.

Isn't that what the vaccines are for?

However, to answer your question: if I was unvaccinated and I dined out, and contracted COVID, which then spread from me to a retirement home causing the death of several elderly people, then, yes, I'd feel pretty shitty about my decision-making. Wouldn't you?

Well first, you'd have to be in the same area at the same time as someone who would have entry to an LTC facility. The odds of that being the case are already quite low. Presumably that person would be vaccinated, being that they work closely with the most vulnerable people. Odds are getting lower still. Finally they'd have to pass it to an elderly person, who would obviously be, you guessed it: fully vaccinated. If you truly believe, as I do, that the vaccines are of any use at all, how many decimal places are we at now in the fractions of a percent of risk to this theoretical elder?