Considering the pay here is 1/4th what they make at Delta, why wouldn't AC or the other airlines here that require it drop this silly requirement?

AC doesn’t require a degree, it’s definitely a plus but not a requirement.

newlygrounded wrote: ↑Tue Jan 18, 2022 11:00 pm Considering the pay here is 1/4th what they make at Delta, why wouldn't AC or the other airlines here that require it drop this silly requirement?

The majority of the Pilots I know at AC are without a degree. The days of that being a requirement are long gone. While it’s definitely an asset in the hiring process, it certainly isn’t a deal breaker.

DL had no choice in dropping the degree requirement due to multilateral flow agreement reached for Endeavor pilots (Delta Connection).

AA flow also straight seniority/qualification. No degree.

Basically these carriers have agreed to hire E175/CRJ CA from their regionals on a seniority basis (from the regional carrier).

I guess being a qualified Part 121 CA trumps a 4 year degree in Pottery Studies. Go figure.

p.s. pilots now starting to quit the secondary US carriers (JB/Alaska/Frontier/Allegiant/Spirit) without degrees and able to move.

There are only 18000 pilots at the US regional airlines with 2022 hiring requirements at the Big 6 of approximately 8700. It will be a blood bath for some carriers.

I predict that ICAO will go to age 67 then the US will follow. Then, it will become an issue about whether to allow foreign national pilots en masse to get pre-approved status to work as commercial pilots in US (with a job offer), similar to nurses.

It is very possible that it could start to look like the 1960’s again when qualified CDN pilots had opportunities on both sides of the border.

For those without a post-graduate degree it is absolutely vital that you include your pronouns (i.e. He/His) on your resumé. Although it might seem insignificant, you need to impress upon the HR person reviewing your profile that your are progressive and can function in a modern inclusive workforce.

ALPApolicy wrote: ↑Wed Jan 19, 2022 11:30 am For those without a post-graduate degree it is absolutely vital that you include your pronouns (i.e. He/His) on your resumé. Although it might seem insignificant, you need to impress upon the HR person reviewing your profile that your are progressive and can function in a modern inclusive workforce.

I have met and worked with many pilots that have degrees, even master's degrees and they were dumb as a post with no social skills and certainly no care or interest in diversity in the workplace (such as sharing pronouns).

Willingness to work for $52k/year for 4 years is far more important than a degree.

Arnie Pye wrote: ↑Wed Jan 19, 2022 1:33 pm Willingness to work for $52k/year for 4 years is far more important than a degree.

And who is working for $52K/yr for 4 years?

rudder wrote: ↑Wed Jan 19, 2022 7:56 am DL had no choice in dropping the degree requirement due to multilateral flow agreement reached for Endeavor pilots (Delta Connection).

AA flow also straight seniority/qualification. No degree.

Basically these carriers have agreed to hire E175/CRJ CA from their regionals on a seniority basis (from the regional carrier).

I guess being a qualified Part 121 CA trumps a 4 year degree in Pottery Studies. Go figure.

p.s. pilots now starting to quit the secondary US carriers (JB/Alaska/Frontier/Allegiant/Spirit) without degrees and able to move.

There are only 18000 pilots at the US regional airlines with 2022 hiring requirements at the Big 6 of approximately 8700. It will be a blood bath for some carriers.

I predict that ICAO will go to age 67 then the US will follow. Then, it will become an issue about whether to allow foreign national pilots en masse to get pre-approved status to work as commercial pilots in US (with a job offer), similar to nurses.

It is very possible that it could start to look like the 1960’s again when qualified CDN pilots had opportunities on both sides of the border.

Would you have an idea of a timeline (next 1/2/3/5/10 yrs) if your prediction were to play out ?

Kosiw wrote: ↑Thu Jan 20, 2022 7:32 am
Would you have an idea of a timeline (next 1/2/3/5/10 yrs) if your prediction were to play out ?

It is all a numbers game. With a little politics, labour relations, and history mixed in.

Probably 2-3 years on Age 67 (ICAO).

US border open to a broader spectrum of foreign pilots? 5+ years.

As soon as it becomes evident they US carriers cannot staff planned flying using current stream of pilots combined with Age 65 retirements, then these issues will become relevant.

jpilot77 wrote: ↑Tue Jan 18, 2022 11:11 pm AC doesn’t require a degree, it’s definitely a plus but not a requirement.

It's listed on their website?

Not sure what you're looking at, but it's not a requirement.

Job Requirements

2000 hours of fixed wing flying time
Completion of schooling to the university entrance level
Ability to pass the Air Canada and Transport Canada medical and visual acuity requirements for a Category 1 medical certificate
Canadian Airline Transport Pilot Licence (ATPL), current Group 1 (Multi-engine) Instrument Rating
Canadian citizenship or landed immigrant status
Pilot applications far exceed job vacancies, so preference is given to candidates with qualifications beyond the basic requirements. Examples of desirable additional qualifications include, but are not limited to:
Graduates of a three or four year diploma/degree program from a college or university
Aviation College degree or diploma
Commercial or military flight experience
Jet and/or glass cockpit experience

Delta dropped the requirements, but your application will score way higher with a degree, Even if you don’t have tpic.

I do see CDN pilot we Ilene to the US, but most likely to fly regionals. Legacies are most likely still be reserved to Us citizens.

The way it might happen is through TN visa, adding pilot to the list of allowable professions to work in the states. This is a NON-immigrant visa, so it does not offer a path to permanent residency or citizenship. Adding to the trouble of getting hired elsewhere than your signing visa company.

Bloodbath coming here to the Us indeed, Reginald are running scare of what’s happening.
No TPIC required anymore to get hired, FO just bouncing after a few years.

indieadventurer wrote: ↑Thu Jan 20, 2022 9:43 pm Not sure what you're looking at, but it's not a requirement.

Job Requirements

2000 hours of fixed wing flying time
Completion of schooling to the university entrance level
Ability to pass the Air Canada and Transport Canada medical and visual acuity requirements for a Category 1 medical certificate
Canadian Airline Transport Pilot Licence (ATPL), current Group 1 (Multi-engine) Instrument Rating
Canadian citizenship or landed immigrant status
Pilot applications far exceed job vacancies, so preference is given to candidates with qualifications beyond the basic requirements. Examples of desirable additional qualifications include, but are not limited to:
Graduates of a three or four year diploma/degree program from a college or university
Aviation College degree or diploma
Commercial or military flight experience
Jet and/or glass cockpit experience

It's not a requirement and hasn't been for some time.

altiplano wrote: ↑Wed Jan 19, 2022 2:00 pm

Arnie Pye wrote: ↑Wed Jan 19, 2022 1:33 pm Willingness to work for $52k/year for 4 years is far more important than a degree.

And who is working for $52K/yr for 4 years?

Is it now $53,000 with cost of living increases?

Arnie Pye wrote: ↑Sun Jan 30, 2022 10:36 pm

altiplano wrote: ↑Wed Jan 19, 2022 2:00 pm

Arnie Pye wrote: ↑Wed Jan 19, 2022 1:33 pm Willingness to work for $52k/year for 4 years is far more important than a degree.

And who is working for $52K/yr for 4 years?

Is it now $53,000 with cost of living increases?

Year 1 minimum guarantee this year goes to $57,375 + pension/benefits.

Year 2 $62,727
Year 3 $71,485
Year 4 $80,050

Not saying it's great, but it's not $52K/year and it's only the minimum guarantee.

Still not impressed ($58k is only about $250 per pay cheque than what I quoted).

Since we are comparing US carriers to Canadian ones, ...

Year one at most US Regional carriers is higher than year four at our Flag carrier especially when you factor in the currency conversion.

Arnie Pye wrote: ↑Mon Jan 31, 2022 8:41 am Still not impressed ($58k is only about $250 per pay cheque than what I quoted).

Since we are comparing US carriers to Canadian ones, ...

Year one at most US Regional carriers is higher than year four at our Flag carrier especially when you factor in the currency conversion.

You said "$52K/yr for 4 years" I am only pointing out the fact that that is incorrect and that the above numbers are minimum guarantees, in reality most will earn more.

It absolutely is too low. The whole Canadian Pilot profession is paid too low from LCC to mainline, cargo to charter, year 1 to year 12.