Colour Vision and Air Canada

seafeye · Post by **seafeye** » Thu Feb 09, 2006 10:02 am

Anyone work for Air Canada and have Colour vision issues?
I still have a first class medical and passed all the DOT test etc...
But still worried this may disqualify me. Anybody have any idea
if the A/C color test disqualifys a person?

Maxxed out · Post by **Maxxed out** » Thu Feb 09, 2006 10:27 am

I just did the Jazz medical, which I think is done to Mainline standards and I failed the plate test. They did the puck test right there which I passed and I had a letter from my optometrist saying I passed 2 of his tests. They called me 6 days later for GS.

They say if you can get your medical you should be ok.

Hope that helps

seafeye · Post by **seafeye** » Thu Feb 09, 2006 10:29 am

Eases some tension.....THX

Maxxed out · Post by **Maxxed out** » Thu Feb 09, 2006 11:00 am

No Problem, I had the same question, asked around and no one had the answer.

It's nice to konw your not wasting your time for something out of your control.

babybus · Post by **babybus** » Thu Feb 09, 2006 12:07 pm

seafeye

I had vision worries also,although not colour vision ones,when I did my AC medical a few years back.I was really worried,just like you.Just before my medical I had a chat with the Doctor and I was told that if you can pass your TC medical you will be just fine.He also told me that 10 years back I would have been out of luck but AC got sued by a few pilots over the fact that they could pass their medicals but why not the AC one.
Anyway they are at AC now and so am I so don't worry too much.
Why dont you call the AC medical center and try to get it from the horses mouth?

tbone · Post by **tbone** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 4:40 pm

Maxxed out wrote:I just did the Jazz medical, which I think is done to Mainline standards and I failed the plate test. They did the puck test right there which I passed and I had a letter from my optometrist saying I passed 2 of his tests. They called me 6 days later for GS.

They say if you can get your medical you should be ok.

Hope that helps

I too am colour blind.. I also have the TC medical letter saying that I have passed the practical tests (had to go look at light signals from a mile away!).. and I have been exempt from the TC and FAA medicals for years. no worries... I'm just hoping that I'm ok for the AC medical! Anone else have any insight? I'm guessing the "puck" test is the Farnsworth.. I've never done that one. I just looked on the Transport Medical site, and I see that they way "the practical test is no longer acceptable"... I wonder if I was "grandfathered" or something.. I am quite worried that if I can't pass the Farnsworth, that AC won't accept my Transport "acceptable" waiver letter since the rules seem to have changed. It should be noted that I have been passing Cat I medicals for years both TC and FAA...
Any ideas?
Thanks!

Traf · Post by **Traf** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 6:22 pm

Yes some sued in the past because AC held them to a higher standard so to solve that AC will make you do a whole pile of tests, interviews and medical. At the end, you could fail the medical but they won't tell you. You will get a letter saying you were uuncessful with no specifics. This way you will not know why you failed and you can't sue.

Good luck!

Inverted2 · Post by **Inverted2** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 6:48 pm

Traf wrote:Yes some sued in the past because AC held them to a higher standard so to solve that AC will make you do a whole pile of tests, interviews and medical. At the end, you could fail the medical but they won't tell you. You will get a letter saying you were uuncessful with no specifics. This way you will not know why you failed and you can't sue.

Good luck!

That's exactly what they're doing now to get around the double standard for medicals. Bastards

Dockjock · Post by **Dockjock** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 10:11 pm

Nope, changed again. Now its interview/cog/psych eval first. Results reviewed by hiring board. If selected, THEN do the medical. Straight from the 'horse's mouth' too. Saves on medical costs and time.

prop2jet · Post by **prop2jet** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 7:04 am

The colour vision "waiver" for the CAT I Medical you have from TC is going to be of no value to you at the AC Medical. If they find that you have any vision issues you will be given a form and told to get a complete eye examination from an eye specialist or optometrist. The specialist will be in a position to tell you right there and then if you pass (in so far as being colourblind), the results you must forward to AC and then wait for the medical reiview board to render a decision. This is at least how I understand the process to work.

tbone · Post by **tbone** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 12:11 pm

prop2jet wrote:The colour vision "waiver" for the CAT I Medical you have from TC is going to be of no value to you at the AC Medical. If they find that you have any vision issues you will be given a form and told to get a complete eye examination from an eye specialist or optometrist. The specialist will be in a position to tell you right there and then if you pass (in so far as being colourblind), the results you must forward to AC and then wait for the medical reiview board to render a decision. This is at least how I understand the process to work.

Any more opinions on this?? I don't understand how Air Canada can have stricter standards on colour vision than Transport Canada?? I thought thats what people sued for in the past.. How is it that I can be "o.k" as far as Transport Canada is concerned but not ok for AC? I can't believe that any chances of my employment at AC is essentially gone.. I hope I still have a chance.

Traf · Post by **Traf** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 1:40 pm

I don't understand how Air Canada can have stricter standards on colour vision than Transport Canada?? I thought thats what people sued for in the past.. How is it that I can be "o.k" as far as Transport Canada is concerned but not ok for AC?

Well, simply put, THEY ARE Air Canada!!! They have a ton of applicants and can afford to bypass a few lame ducks. Why does AC do a medical at all? In theory, a TC medical should be all they need so why do they do a medical at all? Well, maybe they do look for a higher standard or maye they are trying to weed out those that they think will potential "loss of medical candidates" down the road.

Whatever their reason is, you will never know. Since they have been sued by folks in the past they will do all of the tests, interviews and medical and simply tell you that you did no make it. If you fail the medical, you will not be told the reason you got PFO'd because they have caught on to the legal implecations of doing otherwise.

Seems to me you are shiting your pants a bit prematurely though. If you haven't been called for an interview, then don't worry uuntil then. If you have been called for one, you have but one choice. Go to the best you can in the interview etc.. and hope you get by the medical. If you don't, then it was not meant to be. AC is not the only company to work for in Canada. I doubt that anything anyne will teel you on a forum is going to calm your nerves about your vision condition and your chances. This round of hiring is so hit and miss that maybe someone with walleye vision is exactly what they are looking for.

Quit worrying about and give it a go. When you get PFO'd, then it is time to worry about it.

prop2jet · Post by **prop2jet** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 1:57 pm

Quit worrying about and give it a go. When you get PFO'd, then it is time to worry about it.

Well Said!

tbone · Post by **tbone** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 2:19 pm

prop2jet wrote:
Quit worrying about and give it a go. When you get PFO'd, then it is time to worry about it.

Thanks for the advice.. I'll do my best to "quit worrying" .. but it is hard. By the way, I do have the interview in the next 2 weeks.

complexintentions · Post by **complexintentions** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 3:52 pm

Traf wrote:
Well, maybe they do look for a higher standard or maye they are trying to weed out those that they think will potential "loss of medical candidates" down the road.

heheh just an aside... but judging by the massive amount of guys always on med leave they must be doing a bang-up job...

dangerous · Post by **dangerous** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 6:34 pm

What about waivers for myopia? I hear that TC will almost always give you a waiver if your vision falls below the -3 diopter cutoff. Let's say you show up at AC with a cat 1 medical in hand, but with -3.5 diopter vision. Anyone care to comment on this?

Strega · Post by **Strega** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 6:52 pm

How would the AC/Jazz medical staff know your eye prescription anyway??

IF you have a Cat 1 medical, you should be fine.

I have friends that are -6.00 and have no troubles with their medicals, well at least with their eyes anyway!!

dangerous · Post by **dangerous** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 7:17 pm

tcck wrote:How would the AC/Jazz medical staff know your eye prescription anyway??

Would they not send you to an optometrist if you can't read the big E on the eye chart? I would think they may be interested in exactly how bad your eyes are, even if they can be corrected to 20/20.

For what it's worth, AC's website says you must meet the visual acuity requirements for a cat 1 medical. I believe the cat 1 medical cutoff is 3 diopters. Hopefully they stick to 20/20 vision with or without correction.

Strega · Post by **Strega** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 6:47 am

dangerous wrote:
tcck wrote:How would the AC/Jazz medical staff know your eye prescription anyway??
Would they not send you to an optometrist if you can't read the big E on the eye chart? I would think they may be interested in exactly how bad your eyes are, even if they can be corrected to 20/20.

For what it's worth, AC's website says you must meet the visual acuity requirements for a cat 1 medical. I believe the cat 1 medical cutoff is 3 diopters. Hopefully they stick to 20/20 vision with or without correction.

IF the website mentions that you need to meet the cat 1 medical acuity, then even if you are -9.00 and can read the eye chart to the cat 1 standards,, you should be fine,

Refractive errors in your eyes do not affect your "vision quality) ie color blindness. Peoples eyes can be likened to binouculars,, you have good ones and bad ones, even though they can all be in perfect focus.

suprisingly, most people that wear corrective lenses actualy have quite better vision than people that do not, mainly due to the fact that the corrective lenses will correct the refractive errors with in the eye perfectly. The average population that does not wear lenses, generally fall within the -0.5 to +1.75 range. (good enough for most to see fine)

I still find it hard to swallow that AC has its "own" medical limits that are more strict than TCs,,

I for one,, if was disqualified from AC due to a medical issue, and was able to obtain a cat 1 medical with no problems, would sue the pants of them!

IF THE RCMP CAN WEAR TURBANS ON DUTY,, THAN I CAN SURE THE F@#K WEAR GLASSES IN THE COCKPIT!

T

Traf · Post by **Traf** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 7:20 am

I for one,, if was disqualified from AC due to a medical issue, and was able to obtain a cat 1 medical with no problems, would sue the pants of them!

I guess even with your glasses you can't read. Look at a bunch of posts in this thread. AC will NOT tell you that you failed due to a medical stipulation as they have already been sued. They have caught on to the legal dweebs and simply tell you to PFO without reason. If you called and asked them, they would simply say "you were not successful".

tonysoprano · Post by **tonysoprano** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 7:21 am

I still find it hard to swallow that AC has its "own" medical limits that are more strict than TCs,,
I for one,, if was disqualified from AC due to a medical issue, and was able to obtain a cat 1 medical with no problems, would sue the pants of them!

I'm not a lawyer, but I think as a private company, AC can set whatever limits it wants as long as they meet the minimum required by TC. There are no requirements by TC to do Psych tests and yet AC does them. I don't see anyone being sued for that. Anyway, I don't think the eye test would be the problem in your case. In reading your post, there seem to be other issues.

Strega · Post by **Strega** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 7:45 am

I'm not a lawyer, but I think as a private company, AC can set whatever limits it wants as long as they meet the minimum required by TC. There are no requirements by TC to do Psych tests and yet AC does them. I don't see anyone being sued for that. Anyway, I don't think the eye test would be the problem in your case. In reading your post, there seem to be other issues.[/quote]

It always amazes me that pilots will let operators treat them like garbage,, pay them crap and steal their money (remember jetsgo) but the min that we as pilots stand up to them, we are singled out as people with issues.

I dont want to argue with anyone, but if you meet the requirements for the TC medical, and are able to fly for AC, why should you be DQ'd?

(quick question for the AC Guys,, if you loose your TC medical, Does the infamous AC medical still allow you to fly? exactly)

Its the same as operators not hiring Women or Minorities no?

tonysoprano · Post by **tonysoprano** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 8:30 am

I give up. Anyone else want to give it a shot? Good luck.

Strega · Post by **Strega** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 8:43 am

Lurk mode activated again!

Bede · Post by **Bede** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 5:54 pm

Another reason for the higher standards is that TC doesn't care if you ever lose your medical for some reason. Having a pilot retire at 40 because of a medical issue is a huge cost.

Colour Vision and Air Canada

Colour Vision and Air Canada

colour blindness

am I screwed?