Sunwing/Westjet

[tbaylx]

Would Sunwing hire anyone from Westjet before the deal is official and the ink is wet ?

Afterwards, I would guess it would be no. but before ?

asking for a friend. He only has 2 years worth of mainline seniority.

That would be extremely foolish to give up two years of seniority right before a likely seniority list merger.

[doiwannabeapilot]

ok thanks for the info.

As for a seniority list merger; I'm under the impression the 2 companies would not merge the lists nor fly each others aircraft).
If they do merge, doesn't that take years to do and then years more to get appealed / disputed ?
honest questions, not trying to stir the pot.

A 2-4 year upgrade at Sunwing may be better than a 10 year upgrade at WJ mainline (depending on how many years one has left in his /her career).

[nohojob]

Somebody coming to Sunwing with 2k on the 737 is likely to be upgraded within 1 year.

[flyinhigh]

ok thanks for the info.

As for a seniority list merger; I'm under the impression the 2 companies would not merge the lists nor fly each others aircraft).
If they do merge, doesn't that take years to do and then years more to get appealed / disputed ?
honest questions, not trying to stir the pot.

A 2-4 year upgrade at Sunwing may be better than a 10 year upgrade at WJ mainline (depending on how many years one has left in his /her career).

There will certainly be a grand representation vote to bring the sunwing group under the WJ umbrella. WJ scope requires this. Think of Sunwing as another branch of the WestJet group, being operated by WJ pilots. Doesn’t matter if it’s called suck my arse air, it’ll still be WJ pilots.

This has happened in the past, look no further that what went on with the original swoop pilots that thought they could jump the que.

[rudder]

https://apple.news/AJNxpgJdzRGCgdX7J5aMb5A

[Adam Oke]

Somebody coming to Sunwing with 2k on the 737 is likely to be upgraded within 1 year.

In 2022, 38 qualified candidates as per CBA were bypassed with varying service up to 10 years. I would use the term likely very lightly.

[pacman007]

I guess the whole point of these discussions is that,

Will the sunwing pilots who can’t hold left seat on the westket list keep their spot?
SWOOP pilots now didn’t keep their capt seat so the precedent is already set. That’s my opinion.

[rudder]

I guess the whole point of these discussions is that,

Will the sunwing pilots who can’t hold left seat on the westket list keep their spot?
SWOOP pilots now didn’t keep their capt seat so the precedent is already set. That’s my opinion.

The Swoop pilots are not being ‘merged’ with the WJ pilots. They are already on the same seniority list with a single CBA.

Much different scenario than the SW pilots.

Having said that, the PID date matters. And it has already passed. Upgrades and hiring after that date MAY be deemed a product of the merger. It will be up to the arbitration panel.

[TFTMB heavy]

I guess the whole point of these discussions is that,

Will the sunwing pilots who can’t hold left seat on the westket list keep their spot?
SWOOP pilots now didn’t keep their capt seat so the precedent is already set. That’s my opinion.

I doubt that the Swoop situation will affect the merger with Sunwing. There will likely be fences and red circles if required.

The Sunwing business model was killed by the acquisition conditions set but the minister and the new Westjet CA is better than the Sunwing one, there likely won't be much of a representation vote.

The big items will be bases and ratio for the merger of the lists. This, as all mergers, will be a 3 party deal as Westjet will have their say in it for financial reasons.

The more the two unions can settle on the better, arbitration can be disappointing.

[nohojob]

Somebody coming to Sunwing with 2k on the 737 is likely to be upgraded within 1 year.

In 2022, 38 qualified candidates as per CBA were bypassed with varying service up to 10 years. I would use the term likely very lightly.

Yes, you're right, they got bypassed, but called back for the upgrade in Fall 2022.
But of course, there was a good reason for that. We both know why !

[a380super]

Is there anyone here who can prove me that wj contract is better than swg contract???
Still looking desperately..for anything better in the WJ contract compared to ours ( other than the hourly rate)

[cdnavater]

Is there anyone here who can prove me that wj contract is better than swg contract???
Still looking desperately..for anything better in the WJ contract compared to ours ( other than the hourly rate)

380, what difference does it make, better, not better doesn’t really matter at this point. By October it sounds like you will be on the WJ terms and there is only one thing you can do about it, go to another employer.
Your company was sold and your numbers are not enough to swing the vote away from ALPA, you can get a copy of the WJ CBA and figure it out for yourself.
Why don’t you list all the things you like about the Sunwing CBA, I don’t mean anecdotal, I mean actual language of the terms you think are superior and maybe a WJ pilot will be kind enough to address each item.

[nohojob]

By October at the earliest, I doubt it will be that soon despite the plan !

[dontcallmeshirley]

Is there anyone here who can prove me that wj contract is better than swg contract???
Still looking desperately..for anything better in the WJ contract compared to ours ( other than the hourly rate)

Number 1: You will not get bypassed for upgrade just because management wants to benefit a friend of theirs.

[a380super]

Oh thanks....
Number 2 :i just hope we don't have to give up our captain seat for the wj pilots ..
I'm more worried about the downgrade than the upgrade

[Canadaflyer46]

Oh thanks....
Number 2 :i just hope we don't have to give up our captain seat for the wj pilots ..
I'm more worried about the downgrade than the upgrade

If you have 10 or so years seniority then you should be good. Otherwise I imagine it’ll likely be the same as the Swoop merger with red circled pay despite moving to the right seat. Which is still pretty great

[nohojob]

Just speculating (as everybody else).

So some think wj is going to downgrade swg captains and keeping them on their captain salary meanwhile upgrading wj fo instead with up to 10 years of service to replace the downgraded swg captains.

From a financial point of view it doesn't make much sense does it?

A lot cheaper to do as little training as possible.

But again, I am speculating...

[jpilot77]

I’m guessing like in a bunch of other mergers there’ll be fences so you’ll keep your seat. But doing 7-8 turns down south will be gone, I’d guess you'll be doing multiple leg days for 15-16 days a month.

[Canadaflyer46]

Just speculating (as everybody else).

So some think wj is going to downgrade swg captains and keeping them on their captain salary meanwhile upgrading wj fo instead with up to 10 years of service to replace the downgraded swg captains.

From a financial point of view it doesn't make much sense does it?

A lot cheaper to do as little training as possible.

But again, I am speculating...

Training costs don’t come into it. Remember during Covid when they laid off hundreds and retrained them at Encore just to fly a few pairings before coming back to the Boeing? According to the VP of Flt Ops at the time he said that training is free at WestJet.

[nohojob]

I’m guessing like in a bunch of other mergers there’ll be fences so you’ll keep your seat. But doing 7-8 turns down south will be gone, I’d guess you'll be doing multiple leg days for 15-16 days a month.

This scenario seems more realistic to me.