QOL for commuters

[Anonymouse]

Whats the QOL like for AC pilots who commute? Any insight from anyone living in Calgary would be appreciated.

And what are the upgrade times like? How many hours do you need to upgrade?

[PostmasterGeneral]

How many hours do you need to upgrade?

Uh, what?

[negroni]

Rule of thumb, don't plan on commuting more than one province unless it's when you're hired and waiting a few months to get your preferred base. For example Calgary, Kelowna, Edmonton, Victoria too YVR base is livable. Same with any way between YYZ/YOW/YUL. Things get a bit harder if you're an East coast commuter or Winnipeg to YYZ. Don't even think about commuting long term between YVR and YYZ or YUL.

Hours are irrelevant. Everyone hired at AC has the minimums to upgrade. Upgrades are only based on seniority. Currently around 3.5-4 years and dropping.

[Fanblade]

Seniority.

You don’t have a choice when you get hired but every equipment bid there after you do.

Senior YYC - YVR Commuters are doing 14-15 days a month on the 320/737. Overnights in YYC. Late enough starts they can go day of. Early enough stops they get home day of pairing finish.

About 60% ish things get livable. Late starts. Early finishes. Only a few hotels required. Will get a few YYC overnights. 16 days.

Junior. 16 days. Very little YYC overnights. Often need to go the night before. Finish too late to get back day of pairing ending. Can easily turn into 20 days. If you have sim in the month 22.

Reserve. Expect to be working or sitting in YVR 20 days plus having to go the night before.

To answer your question about upgrading. Within a couple of years it will be attainable. However you will spend years on Reserve and junior. Great way to get divorced.

60% range as a narrow body Captain? I’d say 10 years.

Livable commuting means staying senior. It means delaying pay increases until senior.

[Calin Robandfistyou]

Don't forget to Budget about $5000/yr in after tax dollars just to pay for the AIF's.

[goleafsgo]

Things get a bit harder if you're an East coast commuter or Winnipeg to YYZ.

Bit off topic but I commute Ywg-yyz working for jazz and rarely have a problem. If I have been bumped I’ve always made it on the next flight

[negroni]

Things get a bit harder if you're an East coast commuter or Winnipeg to YYZ.

Bit off topic but I commute Ywg-yyz working for jazz and rarely have a problem. If I have been bumped I’ve always made it on the next flight

Good point I have heard of YEG-YYZ being a route that seems to work. Likely due to the low amount of commuters, and lately the capacity and size of aircraft increasing on that route.

[DanWEC]

What about to get to the point where you could have an "acceptable" schedule on the WB side? Just curious. Is the junior schedule inherently more relaxed than the NB side?

[co-joe]

Seniority.

...
Junior. 16 days. Very little YYC overnights. Often need to go the night before. Finish too late to get back day of pairing ending. Can easily turn into 20 days. If you have sim in the month 22.

Reserve. Expect to be working or sitting in YVR 20 days plus having to go the night before.

To answer your question about upgrading. Within a couple of years it will be attainable. However you will spend years on Reserve and junior. Great way to get divorced.

60% range as a narrow body Captain? I’d say 10 years.

Livable commuting means staying senior. It means delaying pay increases until senior.

I admit, I always assumed that AC had the best schedule in the business, more and more I realise your CBA is weak in some areas. Sim training comes out of your days off?

[FL030]

How's the Victoria to Vancouver commute these days? Do think it will be impacted by the Jazz staffing problems and the ferries being canceled a lot?

[negroni]

Seniority.

...
Junior. 16 days. Very little YYC overnights. Often need to go the night before. Finish too late to get back day of pairing ending. Can easily turn into 20 days. If you have sim in the month 22.

Reserve. Expect to be working or sitting in YVR 20 days plus having to go the night before.

To answer your question about upgrading. Within a couple of years it will be attainable. However you will spend years on Reserve and junior. Great way to get divorced.

60% range as a narrow body Captain? I’d say 10 years.

Livable commuting means staying senior. It means delaying pay increases until senior.

I admit, I always assumed that AC had the best schedule in the business, more and more I realise your CBA is weak in some areas. Sim training comes out of your days off?

Lol far from the best. Nearly everyone here works 16 days a month. It wasn't even that bad at the regionals. AC pairing construction is extremely unproductive. Almost deliberately so.

[co-joe]

This post intentionally left blank.

[flyingcanuck]

Seniority.

...
Junior. 16 days. Very little YYC overnights. Often need to go the night before. Finish too late to get back day of pairing ending. Can easily turn into 20 days. If you have sim in the month 22.

Reserve. Expect to be working or sitting in YVR 20 days plus having to go the night before.

To answer your question about upgrading. Within a couple of years it will be attainable. However you will spend years on Reserve and junior. Great way to get divorced.

60% range as a narrow body Captain? I’d say 10 years.

Livable commuting means staying senior. It means delaying pay increases until senior.

I admit, I always assumed that AC had the best schedule in the business, more and more I realise your CBA is weak in some areas. Sim training comes out of your days off?

Lol far from the best. Nearly everyone here works 16 days a month. It wasn't even that bad at the regionals. AC pairing construction is extremely unproductive. Almost deliberately so.

Yikes, 16 a month?? That's very unfortunate..

[Bede]

I admit, I always assumed that AC had the best schedule in the business, more and more I realise your CBA is weak in some areas. Sim training comes out of your days off?

I haven't looked at it in depth, but every time I've discussed schedules with an AC pilot it seems that my schedule at WJ is better. If I bid for layovers/days off I work 14-15 days with weekends off and one layover/pairing in a good destination. (This month I work 15 days, no vacation, have a week off in the middle of the month, Christmas & Christmas eve off, and have 24-48 hrs in HUX, PVR & BGI). I used to do high credit flying and I'd be done in 10 days (but I'd be pretty tired the next day. Another bidding strategy I used to use was late check-ins/early check-outs for easy commuting. I'd work 15 days/mo, no hotel cost, and not fatiguing.

[TheAlcalde]

I admit, I always assumed that AC had the best schedule in the business, more and more I realise your CBA is weak in some areas. Sim training comes out of your days off?

I haven't looked at it in depth, but every time I've discussed schedules with an AC pilot it seems that my schedule at WJ is better. If I bid for layovers/days off I work 14-15 days with weekends off and one layover/pairing in a good destination. (This month I work 15 days, no vacation, have a week off in the middle of the month, Christmas & Christmas eve off, and have 24-48 hrs in HUX, PVR & BGI). I used to do high credit flying and I'd be done in 10 days (but I'd be pretty tired the next day. Another bidding strategy I used to use was late check-ins/early check-outs for easy commuting. I'd work 15 days/mo, no hotel cost, and not fatiguing.

Junior WB Air Canada rosters are the worst I’ve ever heard of. One fellow on my machine had TWENTY ONE days of work. On a WB. Besides the money and variety of work / potential for early upgrade, out working rules are the absolute shits.

[DanWEC]

Well, AC drove down salaries for everyone else, and is now the lowest paying in the country on the junior side as others have started to come up. Why wouldn't they try to drive the schedules to the ground and make it the new norm too? We already have a growing annual deficit of pilots because of decreasing uptake to the career, for good reason. Guess they're expecting some magical solution to the incoming staffing issues instead of facing the impending reality?

Requisite Internet rant aside , are these schedules just a temporary result of short staffing and constant training or are they the actual intended block targets and will be perpetual?

[lownslow]

Requisite Internet rant aside , are these schedules just a temporary result of short staffing and constant training or are they the actual intended block targets and will be perpetual?

My current theory is at least the NB fleets could have much more productive pairings that would cost the company less and get by with fewer pilots working fewer days a month but they don’t want their pilots to get used to that life.

[superbilly24]

How is QOL for an RP holding a block? Would that be easier for a commuter?

[Fanblade]

are these schedules just a temporary result of short staffing and constant training or are they the actual intended block targets and will be perpetual?

Perpetual.

And for an answer above. Sim and Annual recurrent training are in addition to your monthly flying.

There is no max 16 days on the Widebody. Junior on the WB can do 6 Europe out of Eastern Canada. That can easily turn into 18-20 days.

Junior RP is just as bad. If you get stuck with half pay DH's days can add up.

[TheAlcalde]

How is QOL for an RP holding a block? Would that be easier for a commuter?

That 21 day block I mentioned earlier? Junior RP.

This company will reap what it sows. The newer generation of pilots aren’t being hired at 22 and realize that this job doesn’t get you the summer home and fishing boat.