New pay scales

[Crewbunk]

That’s an interesting statement, “a combined contract”, when the merger goes forward is there another negotiation to take place, could Westjet try to meet somewhere in the middle of the two and end up with another potential strike?

Historically, when two pilot groups merge, they have the option of picking the best of both contracts, combining the best aspects.

[rudder]

That’s an interesting statement, “a combined contract”, when the merger goes forward is there another negotiation to take place, could Westjet try to meet somewhere in the middle of the two and end up with another potential strike?

Historically, when two pilot groups merge, they have the option of picking the best of both contracts, combining the best aspects.

Given that there are 2 bargaining agents involved (Unifor/ALPA), first step will be a representation vote.

Operating under the assumption that ALPA prevails, the ALPA Merger Policy will then apply.

The ALPA Merger Policy is a multifaceted policy. It does not simply contemplate a merging of seniority lists, but a merging of elected representatives resulting in a single executive structure, the negotiation of a single CBA, and the integration of seniority lists.

Any vote on a single CBA will be one pilot-one vote of the total merged pilot population. There will be no individual member vote on the integrated seniority list.

It is unlikely the CIRB would allow this integration to create an open period that might permit a strike/lockout.

[Fanblade]

There is no "Me Too" clause. Our pay rate remains the same. Our CBA is up next year. Hopefully we make better gains and establish protection for our crew members and our flying.

Thanks MaxAuto.

The process for mergers is you first select representation. Then you come up with a combined contract. Depending on time lines the combined contract and common representation may come before your current contract expires.

The most painful part of any merger is always the next step which is integration. With that said the parties have very little control. The only opinion that matters will be that of the arbitrator. The arbitrators decision will be based on past decisions. The basic premise is to keep everyone doing the same job they were doing the day before the merge. They look first to DOH. If that doesn’t look reasonable they move on to ratios and fences.

There is no our flying or their flying

That’s an interesting statement, “a combined contract”, when the merger goes forward is there another negotiation to take place, could Westjet try to meet somewhere in the middle of the two and end up with another potential strike?

Rudder said it better than I could have.

There is a reason ALPA policy sets out a combined contract before integration even gets mentioned. So you work together. For example in 2000 Air Canada went to the Canadian pilots and offered them the AirCanada pilot contract on the spot. It was a raise and they took it.

Canadian pilots had a contract that had far better QOL aspects to it. All lost. Opportunity lost.

Westjet management may do the exact same thing if there are parts of the Sunwing contract they don’t want. Or if they decide they don’t want to deal with pilots cherry picking parts of their respective contracts.

[Crewbunk]

For example in 2000 Air Canada went to the Canadian pilots and offered them the AirCanada pilot contract on the spot. It was a raise and they took it.

Canadian pilots had a contract that had far better QOL aspects to it. All lost. Opportunity lost.

Westjet management may do the exact same thing if there are parts of the Sunwing contract they don’t want. Or if they decide they don’t want to deal with pilots cherry picking parts of their respective contracts.

Almost right. It was Air Canada and ACPA that agreed to putting the Air Canada contract in place. Canadian/ALPA was there but had no say. (They watched with astonishment).

The Canadian contract with Air Canada pay was Robert Milton’s worst nightmare. Milton played ACPA like a fiddle. Saying things like “Right now, CP’s pilots ride in J, laughing at you …. we can end that right now, just sign here”.

It’s labour law that the surviving contract can be the combination of both contracts, cherry picking the best. That’s why CP’s contract was so good, it was the combination of the CP, PW, ND, WD, PV and TZ contracts.

The Canadian merger committee advised ACPA that patience will result in the best of both worlds. But it’s optional, not mandatory.

Same thing in this case. There may well be facets in the Sunwing contract that Westjet may like. They have that option.

Now …. the seniority integration is something entirely different. If not mutually agreed, (it rarely is), then arbitration will result. I’ve seen five mergers first hand, and studied hundreds.

[Fanblade]

For example in 2000 Air Canada went to the Canadian pilots and offered them the AirCanada pilot contract on the spot. It was a raise and they took it.

Canadian pilots had a contract that had far better QOL aspects to it. All lost. Opportunity lost.

Westjet management may do the exact same thing if there are parts of the Sunwing contract they don’t want. Or if they decide they don’t want to deal with pilots cherry picking parts of their respective contracts.

Almost right. It was Air Canada and ACPA that agreed to putting the Air Canada contract in place. Canadian/ALPA was there but had no say. (They watched with astonishment).

The Canadian contract with Air Canada pay was Robert Milton’s worst nightmare. Milton played ACPA like a fiddle. Saying things like “Right now, CP’s pilots ride in J, laughing at you …. we can end that right now, just sign here”.

It’s labour law that the surviving contract can be the combination of both contracts, cherry picking the best. That’s why CP’s contract was so good, it was the combination of the CP, PW, ND, WD, PV and TZ contracts.

The Canadian merger committee advised ACPA that patience will result in the best of both worlds. But it’s optional, not mandatory.

Same thing in this case. There may well be facets in the Sunwing contract that Westjet may like. They have that option.

Now …. the seniority integration is something entirely different. If not mutually agreed, (it rarely is), then arbitration will result. I’ve seen five mergers first hand, and studied hundreds.

Thanks for the correction crewbunk.

You just made the point I was trying to make even more relevant.

WORK TOGETHER. Don’t get caught up in us vs them. Leave all the us vs them stuff to the two merger committees.

[Crewbunk]

You just made the point I was trying to make even more relevant.

WORK TOGETHER. Don’t get caught up in us vs them. Leave all the us vs them stuff to the two merger committees.

One point you made is entirely correct and it explains what happened during the AC/CP merge. The contract combination occurs around the same time as the seniority integration. If that’s not going well, and the AC/CP merge was not, then working together is tough.

It’s hard, but leaving emotion aside and thinking towards the future usually has better results.

[cdnavater]

Thanks to all three of you, that’s way better than I imagined the scenario would play out.