When Alberta separate, will it keep Canadian licensing or go the FAA route?

[aviran9111]

Question that came to mind after the new Citizens initiative Bill amendments takes affect:
After Alberta separate, do you think it will keep TC licensing regime or go the FAA route and copy their licensing regime?

Recap: Alberta government is putting a bill that will change the required a petition signature that forces a referendum from 600,000 required signature
down to 177,000 and 90 days limit increase to 120 days limit. After that passes, once a petition gather the required signatures, it is binding on the government to put the referendum for a vote, which is more than likely to take place this Fall during the municipal elections. If passes (requires 50% + 1), it binds on all the provinces, the federal government and the indigenous community to seat down and talk about Alberta succession\separation, which at this point MUST happen and no one can seat it out and any arrangement an be forced on the arguing party (for example given by constitutional lawyer Keith Wilson is, if the indigenous community refuses any offer, they can be remained as Canadian territory fully taxed on incoming/outgoing goods or become Alberta territory, given up and special treatment they get, assuming they refuse to talk). This process can NOT be ruled or intervened by the courts.

Of course the wild card here is Donald Trump. He might want to put an offer to purchase Alberta after the referendum passes, and that will moot the question.

But what do you think will happen to the aviation authority?

[planenuts]

@#$! off

[cncpc]

OP...

Do you have a pilot's medical, or any aviation medical that asks questions related to truthfulness and ability to assemble facts and determine courses of action?

Would you still have it if the doctor had seen what you just posted?

[flying4dollars]

Question that came to mind after the new Citizens initiative Bill amendments takes affect:
After Alberta separate, do you think it will keep TC licensing regime or go the FAA route and copy their licensing regime?

Recap: Alberta government is putting a bill that will change the required a petition signature that forces a referendum from 600,000 required signature
down to 177,000 and 90 days limit increase to 120 days limit. After that passes, once a petition gather the required signatures, it is binding on the government to put the referendum for a vote, which is more than likely to take place this Fall during the municipal elections. If passes (requires 50% + 1), it binds on all the provinces, the federal government and the indigenous community to seat down and talk about Alberta succession\separation, which at this point MUST happen and no one can seat it out and any arrangement an be forced on the arguing party (for example given by constitutional lawyer Keith Wilson is, if the indigenous community refuses any offer, they can be remained as Canadian territory fully taxed on incoming/outgoing goods or become Alberta territory, given up and special treatment they get, assuming they refuse to talk). This process can NOT be ruled or intervened by the courts.

Of course the wild card here is Donald Trump. He might want to put an offer to purchase Alberta after the referendum passes, and that will moot the question.

But what do you think will happen to the aviation authority?

....bro what?

[aviran9111]

Question that came to mind after the new Citizens initiative Bill amendments takes affect:
After Alberta separate, do you think it will keep TC licensing regime or go the FAA route and copy their licensing regime?

Recap: Alberta government is putting a bill that will change the required a petition signature that forces a referendum from 600,000 required signature
down to 177,000 and 90 days limit increase to 120 days limit. After that passes, once a petition gather the required signatures, it is binding on the government to put the referendum for a vote, which is more than likely to take place this Fall during the municipal elections. If passes (requires 50% + 1), it binds on all the provinces, the federal government and the indigenous community to seat down and talk about Alberta succession\separation, which at this point MUST happen and no one can seat it out and any arrangement an be forced on the arguing party (for example given by constitutional lawyer Keith Wilson is, if the indigenous community refuses any offer, they can be remained as Canadian territory fully taxed on incoming/outgoing goods or become Alberta territory, given up and special treatment they get, assuming they refuse to talk). This process can NOT be ruled or intervened by the courts.

Of course the wild card here is Donald Trump. He might want to put an offer to purchase Alberta after the referendum passes, and that will moot the question.

But what do you think will happen to the aviation authority?

....bro what?

There is a clear indications that a separation referendum will take place this fall in Alberta. If it passes, which 90%+ support for the CPC suggest it might gets the needed 50+1 (last one in Quebec, as you remember, got 49.5%, and Alberta nowadays, after 10 years of a federal Liberal government, is by far more united than any other Canadian province in history).

Among the many other things (e.g. currency, military, border responsibility, taxation etc), aviation will also be a topic for Alberta to figure out on their own, so my question is - do you think they will keep the TC licensing and laws regime (as the Aeronautics Act will no longer apply to Canada) or they will adapt the FAA laws and regulations? Or even make a new one.

[Daniel Cooper]

It largely depends on what happens after secession. If Alberta seperates it's highly likely it will join the United States. Their airspace will become United States airspace then and therefore fall under FAA administration.

[cdnavater]

It largely depends on what happens after secession. If Alberta seperates it's highly likely it will join the United States. Their airspace will become United States airspace then and therefore fall under FAA administration.

Will WJ be an American airline then?

[Daniel Cooper]

If they comply with FAA regulations they could be, yes.

[aviran9111]

It largely depends on what happens after secession. If Alberta seperates it's highly likely it will join the United States. Their airspace will become United States airspace then and therefore fall under FAA administration.

Will WJ be an American airline then?

That will work greatly in their favour. Since Canadian decided they are too fancy to travel to the US, if they become a a US carrier, they can operate anywhere to/from the US.

[itsgrosswhatinet]

They'll have to double pilot salaries if they don't want them all to leave for other American carriers.

[aviran9111]

It largely depends on what happens after secession. If Alberta seperates it's highly likely it will join the United States. Their airspace will become United States airspace then and therefore fall under FAA administration.

The good news is the bilateral conversion agreement, so all the licenses will be easily converted, with the exception of the instructor rating (instructor will have to get their CFI/CFII/MEI if they are interested)

[aviran9111]

They'll have to double pilot salaries if they don't want them all to leave for other American carriers.

That won't happen easily. In order to be a captain on a Part 121, you need 1,000 hours as a part 121. So captains will go back to the right seat for a minimum of one year, but probably a lot longer.

I wonder how their egos will take that

[rigpiggy]

Canada should have synchronized with USA long ago.

[rigpiggy]

Besides some us carriers pay fos better than Canada

[Dias]

That won't happen easily. In order to be a captain on a Part 121, you need 1,000 hours as a part 121. So captains will go back to the right seat for a minimum of one year, but probably a lot longer.

I wonder how their egos will take that

There will be an exemption due to the circumstances.

[DanWEC]

Who's Albert?

[JBI]

Question that came to mind after the new Citizens initiative Bill amendments takes affect:
After Alberta separate, do you think it will keep TC licensing regime or go the FAA route and copy their licensing regime?

Recap: Alberta government is putting a bill that will change the required a petition signature that forces a referendum from 600,000 required signature
down to 177,000 and 90 days limit increase to 120 days limit. After that passes, once a petition gather the required signatures, it is binding on the government to put the referendum for a vote, which is more than likely to take place this Fall during the municipal elections. If passes (requires 50% + 1), it binds on all the provinces, the federal government and the indigenous community to seat down and talk about Alberta succession\separation, which at this point MUST happen and no one can seat it out and any arrangement an be forced on the arguing party (for example given by constitutional lawyer Keith Wilson is, if the indigenous community refuses any offer, they can be remained as Canadian territory fully taxed on incoming/outgoing goods or become Alberta territory, given up and special treatment they get, assuming they refuse to talk). This process can NOT be ruled or intervened by the courts.

Of course the wild card here is Donald Trump. He might want to put an offer to purchase Alberta after the referendum passes, and that will moot the question.

But what do you think will happen to the aviation authority?

There are about 8 steps back you'd need to take. You're not totally wrong, but there are a significant number of steps that would need to happen prior to any type of succession by a province.

In addition to needing to have a clear majority (no number is stated in the Clarity Act, so I'd say 'it depends' if 50%+1 is simply enough), there needs to be consultation with multiple interested parties (i.e. First Nations, Opposition Parties etc.), next the negotiations would be necessary to determine a whole swath of issues (i.e. the borders of the area separating - the Supreme Court has suggested that it's not a given that the borders would be the same as well as what would happen with the billions of dollars of land/buildings/infrastructure owned by the Federal Government in the Province -it's not like the Federal Gov't would give these things up for free).

Finally, AFTER a negotiated settlement was an agreed to, it would then require a constitutional amendment which isn't something that can be done unilaterally by one Province. The standard amendment formula is that 7 out of 10 provinces representing more than 50% of the Population of the country needs to agree. However, I'm not 100% certain the amendment formula that would be needed for a succession.

How aviation, and other previously federal powers would be handled would likely be determined in the negotiations.

In the 2025 election, it looks like in Alberta, the Cons got approximately 72% of the Popular vote with 70% of eligible votes voting. Do you think all 72% want to separate from the country? I don't think so. Wanting a new Government after the Liberals of the last 10 years is one thing, but wanting to leave the Country is another.

[Ash Ketchum]

I bet a lot of pilots would love Alberta to separate, myself included. No more trying to jump through hoops to get the green card.

Finally get a chance to work for Delta, make twice the money, and pay half the tax…

[aviran9111]

Question that came to mind after the new Citizens initiative Bill amendments takes affect:
After Alberta separate, do you think it will keep TC licensing regime or go the FAA route and copy their licensing regime?

Recap: Alberta government is putting a bill that will change the required a petition signature that forces a referendum from 600,000 required signature
down to 177,000 and 90 days limit increase to 120 days limit. After that passes, once a petition gather the required signatures, it is binding on the government to put the referendum for a vote, which is more than likely to take place this Fall during the municipal elections. If passes (requires 50% + 1), it binds on all the provinces, the federal government and the indigenous community to seat down and talk about Alberta succession\separation, which at this point MUST happen and no one can seat it out and any arrangement an be forced on the arguing party (for example given by constitutional lawyer Keith Wilson is, if the indigenous community refuses any offer, they can be remained as Canadian territory fully taxed on incoming/outgoing goods or become Alberta territory, given up and special treatment they get, assuming they refuse to talk). This process can NOT be ruled or intervened by the courts.

Of course the wild card here is Donald Trump. He might want to put an offer to purchase Alberta after the referendum passes, and that will moot the question.

But what do you think will happen to the aviation authority?

There are about 8 steps back you'd need to take. You're not totally wrong, but there are a significant number of steps that would need to happen prior to any type of succession by a province.

In addition to needing to have a clear majority (no number is stated in the Clarity Act, so I'd say 'it depends' if 50%+1 is simply enough), there needs to be consultation with multiple interested parties (i.e. First Nations, Opposition Parties etc.), next the negotiations would be necessary to determine a whole swath of issues (i.e. the borders of the area separating - the Supreme Court has suggested that it's not a given that the borders would be the same as well as what would happen with the billions of dollars of land/buildings/infrastructure owned by the Federal Government in the Province -it's not like the Federal Gov't would give these things up for free).

Finally, AFTER a negotiated settlement was an agreed to, it would then require a constitutional amendment which isn't something that can be done unilaterally by one Province. The standard amendment formula is that 7 out of 10 provinces representing more than 50% of the Population of the country needs to agree. However, I'm not 100% certain the amendment formula that would be needed for a succession.

How aviation, and other previously federal powers would be handled would likely be determined in the negotiations.

In the 2025 election, it looks like in Alberta, the Cons got approximately 72% of the Popular vote with 70% of eligible votes voting. Do you think all 72% want to separate from the country? I don't think so. Wanting a new Government after the Liberals of the last 10 years is one thing, but wanting to leave the Country is another.

They will. Also don't forget, Trump can buy Alberta with only their agreement, other provinces or the feds has no say, which can also happen. That will make separation a whole lot easier, since the next step will be a referendum on joining the Union, and from there, if passed, it's up to Uncle Sam to approve in congress, which they 100% will.

I am also certain that if the referendum to separate passes, other provinces may agree or disagree, but they won't be able to stop it.

[digits_]

I bet a lot of pilots would love Alberta to separate, myself included. No more trying to jump through hoops to get the green card.

Finally get a chance to work for Delta, make twice the money, and pay half the tax…

There's a huge difference between wanting to separate and wanting to join the US. I am quite certain you will not get a majority for both scenarios.

[JBI]

Question that came to mind after the new Citizens initiative Bill amendments takes affect:
After Alberta separate, do you think it will keep TC licensing regime or go the FAA route and copy their licensing regime?

Recap: Alberta government is putting a bill that will change the required a petition signature that forces a referendum from 600,000 required signature
down to 177,000 and 90 days limit increase to 120 days limit. After that passes, once a petition gather the required signatures, it is binding on the government to put the referendum for a vote, which is more than likely to take place this Fall during the municipal elections. If passes (requires 50% + 1), it binds on all the provinces, the federal government and the indigenous community to seat down and talk about Alberta succession\separation, which at this point MUST happen and no one can seat it out and any arrangement an be forced on the arguing party (for example given by constitutional lawyer Keith Wilson is, if the indigenous community refuses any offer, they can be remained as Canadian territory fully taxed on incoming/outgoing goods or become Alberta territory, given up and special treatment they get, assuming they refuse to talk). This process can NOT be ruled or intervened by the courts.

Of course the wild card here is Donald Trump. He might want to put an offer to purchase Alberta after the referendum passes, and that will moot the question.

But what do you think will happen to the aviation authority?

There are about 8 steps back you'd need to take. You're not totally wrong, but there are a significant number of steps that would need to happen prior to any type of succession by a province.

In addition to needing to have a clear majority (no number is stated in the Clarity Act, so I'd say 'it depends' if 50%+1 is simply enough), there needs to be consultation with multiple interested parties (i.e. First Nations, Opposition Parties etc.), next the negotiations would be necessary to determine a whole swath of issues (i.e. the borders of the area separating - the Supreme Court has suggested that it's not a given that the borders would be the same as well as what would happen with the billions of dollars of land/buildings/infrastructure owned by the Federal Government in the Province -it's not like the Federal Gov't would give these things up for free).

Finally, AFTER a negotiated settlement was an agreed to, it would then require a constitutional amendment which isn't something that can be done unilaterally by one Province. The standard amendment formula is that 7 out of 10 provinces representing more than 50% of the Population of the country needs to agree. However, I'm not 100% certain the amendment formula that would be needed for a succession.

How aviation, and other previously federal powers would be handled would likely be determined in the negotiations.

In the 2025 election, it looks like in Alberta, the Cons got approximately 72% of the Popular vote with 70% of eligible votes voting. Do you think all 72% want to separate from the country? I don't think so. Wanting a new Government after the Liberals of the last 10 years is one thing, but wanting to leave the Country is another.

They will. Also don't forget, Trump can buy Alberta with only their agreement, other provinces or the feds has no say, which can also happen. That will make separation a whole lot easier, since the next step will be a referendum on joining the Union, and from there, if passed, it's up to Uncle Sam to approve in congress, which they 100% will.

I am also certain that if the referendum to separate passes, other provinces may agree or disagree, but they won't be able to stop it.

I’m glad you’re certain…

[aviran9111]

There are about 8 steps back you'd need to take. You're not totally wrong, but there are a significant number of steps that would need to happen prior to any type of succession by a province.

In addition to needing to have a clear majority (no number is stated in the Clarity Act, so I'd say 'it depends' if 50%+1 is simply enough), there needs to be consultation with multiple interested parties (i.e. First Nations, Opposition Parties etc.), next the negotiations would be necessary to determine a whole swath of issues (i.e. the borders of the area separating - the Supreme Court has suggested that it's not a given that the borders would be the same as well as what would happen with the billions of dollars of land/buildings/infrastructure owned by the Federal Government in the Province -it's not like the Federal Gov't would give these things up for free).

Finally, AFTER a negotiated settlement was an agreed to, it would then require a constitutional amendment which isn't something that can be done unilaterally by one Province. The standard amendment formula is that 7 out of 10 provinces representing more than 50% of the Population of the country needs to agree. However, I'm not 100% certain the amendment formula that would be needed for a succession.

How aviation, and other previously federal powers would be handled would likely be determined in the negotiations.

In the 2025 election, it looks like in Alberta, the Cons got approximately 72% of the Popular vote with 70% of eligible votes voting. Do you think all 72% want to separate from the country? I don't think so. Wanting a new Government after the Liberals of the last 10 years is one thing, but wanting to leave the Country is another.

They will. Also don't forget, Trump can buy Alberta with only their agreement, other provinces or the feds has no say, which can also happen. That will make separation a whole lot easier, since the next step will be a referendum on joining the Union, and from there, if passed, it's up to Uncle Sam to approve in congress, which they 100% will.

I am also certain that if the referendum to separate passes, other provinces may agree or disagree, but they won't be able to stop it.

I’m glad you’re certain…

The mainstream media always attempt to belittle the conservative movement and the separation movement in Alberta, just as the favoritism they did to Carney. Instead of talk of "it will never happen", maybe the focus should be "why is it even happen in the first place", because when it does happen - it will be too late to ask this question - the referendum, if passes, is binding on everyone, even if it's just 51%.

[Arnie Pye]

Last week I heard that 35% of Albertans want to separate. It was as high as 49% in the late 1980's. You've got a long way to go to convince 25% of the province to support this.
I'm not saying it couldn't happen. One more gun confiscation program might do it.

[aviran9111]

Last week I heard that 35% of Albertans want to separate. It was as high as 49% in the late 1980's. You've got a long way to go to convince 25% of the province to support this.
I'm not saying it couldn't happen. One more gun confiscation program might do it.

I expect the confiscation attempt to meet the same resistance Quebec showed in the 1970 - violent bloodbath. Since in rural places, the cops live in the same community as their "targets", they will either have to move out, tearing their family from everything they know or refuse the order. People are not going to give in tens of thousands worth of property for the bare minimum. Add the no more pipelines and net zero ideology, and the numbers will spiral out of control.

But those 35% numbers are inaccurate too, because it can target the little NDP strongholds to affect the question, and it does not target rural Alberta, which is far less likely to participate in any online survey.

But again, it dodges the question - what will happen the day after, in the sense of - will the go the route of independent civil authority or copy the TC/FAA route (I hope they go the FAA route as instructors never to go through checkrides after passing one, as long as they are active, and time building is extremely easier).

PS. - Even if it is 35%, you only need to convince 16%, not 25% (it's 50% +1)

[Daniel Cooper]

Who's Albert?

What's succession? Everyone makes grammatical errors, even lawyer types. In my experience, if pilots made as many small mistakes as lawyers there would be a lot of aircraft off the end of runways.