New YYC Sim facility with CAE

[Airbrake]

News out today of a new YYC sim facility opening in 2028.
NG, Max, 787 & Q400 sims.

Press release to follow.

[careerpilot?]

New Q400 sims. Would imply WestJet has no intention of folding Encore / retiring the Q if they’re building new sims for it. Good news.

[BTD]

Don’t believe anything about airplanes until the guy next to you says “V1”

[planenuts]

New Q400 sims. Would imply WestJet has no intention of folding Encore / retiring the Q if they’re building new sims for it. Good news.

I guess....

[careerpilot?]

New Q400 sims. Would imply WestJet has no intention of folding Encore / retiring the Q if they’re building new sims for it. Good news.

I guess....

Is it not?

[Daigo]

Im curious; why do some people think thata 737 can replace a Q? It seems so obvious that im confused why it's suggested so often. Even if you try replace it with a smaller jet like an embraer or A220, nothing would come close to meeting the Q's efficiency for low demand short haul markets. Unless if you drastically reduce service to force a 37, but why the hell would you do that

[cdnavater]

Im curious; why do some people think thata 737 can replace a Q? It seems so obvious that im confused why it's suggested so often. Even if you try replace it with a smaller jet like an embraer or A220, nothing would come close to meeting the Q's efficiency for low demand short haul markets. Unless if you drastically reduce service to force a 37, but why the hell would you do that

As to why, because reduced frequency takes some stress of staffing levels, same amount of pilots required to fly 78 or 160 passengers.
Also, keep in mind that most of the routes operated by Encore used to be serviced by the 37 and could be again if needed.

[Daigo]

Im curious; why do some people think thata 737 can replace a Q? It seems so obvious that im confused why it's suggested so often. Even if you try replace it with a smaller jet like an embraer or A220, nothing would come close to meeting the Q's efficiency for low demand short haul markets. Unless if you drastically reduce service to force a 37, but why the hell would you do that

As to why, because reduced frequency takes some stress of staffing levels, same amount of pilots required to fly 78 or 160 passengers.
Also, keep in mind that most of the routes operated by Encore used to be serviced by the 37 and could be again if needed.

I doubt that the staffing levels are so severly depleted that it would warrant a move like that, especially not at the current state of the job market. I think pilots in this forum overestimate our influence as an employee group. Not every decision is pilot related. And again, the Q is vastly more efficient than a jet and allows for better network service while saving on aircraft and employee group cost. You'd need a really good reason to let go of that

[Tolippilot]

Im curious; why do some people think thata 737 can replace a Q? It seems so obvious that im confused why it's suggested so often. Even if you try replace it with a smaller jet like an embraer or A220, nothing would come close to meeting the Q's efficiency for low demand short haul markets. Unless if you drastically reduce service to force a 37, but why the hell would you do that

Because most pilots should just fly the planes and not be aloud to make managment decisions

The Q does a better job on 90% of the encore routes then the jet, allowing a higher amount of daily flight, lower cost and financial stability between high and low season markets. The Q makes money on every flight and is a safe bet on lower yield routes. Taking a 737 into grand Prairie or Terrance is NEVER going to be a smart business decision. When westjet used to take 737s into these markets it was years and years ago in much smaller versions of the 737; what they are flying now is a very different tool.

Many mainline pilots just can't imagine a world where their precious 737 isn't the best machine for a job

[Daigo]

Im curious; why do some people think thata 737 can replace a Q? It seems so obvious that im confused why it's suggested so often. Even if you try replace it with a smaller jet like an embraer or A220, nothing would come close to meeting the Q's efficiency for low demand short haul markets. Unless if you drastically reduce service to force a 37, but why the hell would you do that

Because most pilots should just fly the planes and not be aloud to make managment decisions

The Q does a better job on 90% of the encore routes then the jet, allowing a higher amount of daily flight, lower cost and financial stability between high and low season markets. The Q makes money on every flight and is a safe bet on lower yield routes. Taking a 737 into grand Prairie or Terrance is NEVER going to be a smart business decision. When westjet used to take 737s into these markets it was years and years ago in much smaller versions of the 737; what they are flying now is a very different tool.

Many mainline pilots just can't imagine a world where their precious 737 isn't the best machine for a job

Exactly right

Its funny reading people here try to relate every management decision having to do with us or ALPA "stepping in" for making company decions. You never see FA's being delusional enough to think a company would operate a certain airplane to allow for a bigger galley... or to make the groomer's job a bit easier. At the end of the day, you're only just an employee and management will always make decisions to benefit the company's bottom line. They wont take you into consideration as long as everything is legal

[-TSRA]

I’ll take a middle of the road answer here. Obviously the Q is much better suited to thin routes than a 737 - no argument there. On the other hand, and not in this context, management does take pilots into account when managing their fleet. As an example look at what’s happened to regional and narrowbody fleets over the last 10 years in the US market. As pilot supply dried up, real wages went up significantly. Whereas with 2010 wages, 50 seat RJs and 737-700/A320s were ubiquitous, now airlines want more seats per pilot, so only the larger RJs and longer narrow bodies make sense. There is a reason why nobody is building 50 seat jets and very few are ordering the MAX 7 or 320NEO. It’s all MAX 8 and up and 321s. Pilots are by far the most expensive non management labour group at an airline and are for sure considered in these decisions. Do we overstate our importance in these decisions? Probably, but less so today than a decade ago.

[fish4life]

Im curious; why do some people think thata 737 can replace a Q? It seems so obvious that im confused why it's suggested so often. Even if you try replace it with a smaller jet like an embraer or A220, nothing would come close to meeting the Q's efficiency for low demand short haul markets. Unless if you drastically reduce service to force a 37, but why the hell would you do that

Because most pilots should just fly the planes and not be aloud to make managment decisions

The Q does a better job on 90% of the encore routes then the jet, allowing a higher amount of daily flight, lower cost and financial stability between high and low season markets. The Q makes money on every flight and is a safe bet on lower yield routes. Taking a 737 into grand Prairie or Terrance is NEVER going to be a smart business decision. When westjet used to take 737s into these markets it was years and years ago in much smaller versions of the 737; what they are flying now is a very different tool.

Many mainline pilots just can't imagine a world where their precious 737 isn't the best machine for a job

If it’s anything like AC the Q unlikely makes money as most of the passengers are mostly connecting, so the segment cost of that connection is pretty short.

What the regional does a good job of is filling the larger NB and WB’s that make money on the longer routes.

[5degrees]

Im curious; why do some people think thata 737 can replace a Q? It seems so obvious that im confused why it's suggested so often. Even if you try replace it with a smaller jet like an embraer or A220, nothing would come close to meeting the Q's efficiency for low demand short haul markets. Unless if you drastically reduce service to force a 37, but why the hell would you do that

Because most pilots should just fly the planes and not be aloud to make managment decisions

The Q does a better job on 90% of the encore routes then the jet, allowing a higher amount of daily flight, lower cost and financial stability between high and low season markets. The Q makes money on every flight and is a safe bet on lower yield routes. Taking a 737 into grand Prairie or Terrance is NEVER going to be a smart business decision. When westjet used to take 737s into these markets it was years and years ago in much smaller versions of the 737; what they are flying now is a very different tool.

Many mainline pilots just can't imagine a world where their precious 737 isn't the best machine for a job

If by years and years ago you mean last year when WEN was in a potential strike situation? WJ was flying 800s into YCD! WJ covered most of the WEN route network last summer. Not that I was too keen for another Fort Mac layover...(ex WEN )

[Tolippilot]

Im curious; why do some people think thata 737 can replace a Q? It seems so obvious that im confused why it's suggested so often. Even if you try replace it with a smaller jet like an embraer or A220, nothing would come close to meeting the Q's efficiency for low demand short haul markets. Unless if you drastically reduce service to force a 37, but why the hell would you do that

Because most pilots should just fly the planes and not be aloud to make managment decisions

The Q does a better job on 90% of the encore routes then the jet, allowing a higher amount of daily flight, lower cost and financial stability between high and low season markets. The Q makes money on every flight and is a safe bet on lower yield routes. Taking a 737 into grand Prairie or Terrance is NEVER going to be a smart business decision. When westjet used to take 737s into these markets it was years and years ago in much smaller versions of the 737; what they are flying now is a very different tool.

Many mainline pilots just can't imagine a world where their precious 737 isn't the best machine for a job

If by years and years ago you mean last year when WEN was in a potential strike situation? WJ was flying 800s into YCD! WJ covered most of the WEN route network last summer. Not that I was too keen for another Fort Mac layover...(ex WEN )

The 737 did operate ycd, you are correct. And it was a disaster, load restricted, could only land going one direction, tailwind limited, every pilot i spoke to about it hated it, i deadheaded in there afew times in the jet and every landing was a slam, because the runway is not long. The entire thing was wildly impractical. So your kind of just proving my point here. YES you can fly a 737 into these places, but its not a smart business move, the Q is the better aircraft for it. Same with 90% of encore routes. I agree there are afew that the jet can do without the Q, but most of those routes like yyc Saskatoon and all are already being done by both aircraft types, they just add the Q for additional options for pax, other examples are Abbotsford, regina, yellowknife, etc.

[planenuts]

The 737 did operate ycd, you are correct. And it was a disaster, load restricted, could only land going one direction, tailwind limited, every pilot i spoke to about it hated it, i deadheaded in there afew times in the jet and every landing was a slam, because the runway is not long.

...and yet - surprise surprise they still operate into YCD with the 737 seasonally.

Maybe its the fact that the Q operation is an operational nightmare and the planes are maintenance pigs. Now add the fact of the fleet reduction and the pullout from the east just sort of make the whole thing a lame duck. Kinda like the whole widebody program. The company sorta jumps in with one foot and lingers for far too long trying to make up its mind.

[co-joe]

I think if CAE is building a sim facility in yyc it's a fantastic move. Hopefully it's a facility open to all airlines, not just WestJet. Lynx was in the process of starting a training facility here when they shut down with FTD's and Level D Max 8 sims. With our weak dollar, a CAE facility could be a much cheaper option for travel, accommodations, and training than having to deal with yyz, and yul.

[Eric Janson]

New Q400 sims. Would imply WestJet has no intention of folding Encore / retiring the Q if they’re building new sims for it. Good news.

There exists a thing called 3rd party training where training slots are sold to other Airlines. Very lucrative.

I’m sure CAE will offer full courses to companies all over the world.

Don’t think that this facility will only be used by WestJet.

[cdnavater]

New Q400 sims. Would imply WestJet has no intention of folding Encore / retiring the Q if they’re building new sims for it. Good news.

There exists a thing called 3rd party training where training slots are sold to other Airlines. Very lucrative.

I’m sure CAE will offer full courses to companies all over the world.

Don’t think that this facility will only be used by WestJet.

Yes but WJ will be their primary customer and other airlines will get the crappy overnight slots