Flight Training

[Tango01]

Sitting at the terminal of my home airport with my headset in my left hand and a coffee in my right, I stared at the ceiling, thinking "what a waste" The school wouldn't dispatch aircraft that day because of a frightening 13 knot crosswind (which was less than that, considering the METAR gives wind information in degrees true) But that would have made no difference, because the airplanes were full of snow and frost, and nobody bothered to do something about it. Just the week before that, I saw a student pilot scrapping off ice from the wing with his MasterCard while his instructor talked on the cellphone

Then I began to wonder all the restrictions placed uppon rental pilots and students. (Some of these, don't apply to ALL FTU's)

•No "strong" crosswinds.
•No flying into grass or gravel fields.
•No flying if temperature is colder than X degrees.
•No flying in Marginal VFR.
•No tailwheel training as normal training (only specialized).
•No IFR training in IMC.
•No operations on runways shorter than xxxx feet.

And the list goes on and on. Now, I know we reached an era where we are owned by insurance companies, but how are pilots supposed to improve their abilities, skills, and judgement if they are not exposed to a variety of scenerios? I think we're punishing pilots instead of encouraging them to get out there and truly learn how to fly, and this confidence flying can start from the get go with proper training. But this proper training can't exist if instructors weren't properly trained, and the cycle continues.

Simply stating that practicing circuits on a blue day with 10 knot headwind on the same runway at the same old airport, produces no results.

Ground school is another problem. Some places are charging $400-500 for a CPL ground school, and the instructor has no clue how a transponder works.

Just a though.

[Hedley]

No "strong" crosswinds.

The FTU probably doesn't want the low-time solo student pilot to wreck the airplane. However, with an instructor on board, everything changes - he ought to be comfortable with the windsock straight out, across the runway. If he isn't get another instructor

No flying into grass or gravel fields.

gravel is hard on the prop, but again, with an instructor, you ought to fly off grass during your training. If the FTU/CFI doesn't allow it, vote with your wallet and spend you money at one that does

No flying if temperature is colder than X degrees.

What's "X"? All the new plastic airplanes have cold temp limits as part of their certification.

No flying in Marginal VFR.

Again, not so good for student pilot with 30TT, but with an instructor, you should have at 'er. See above comments about switching FTU.

No tailwheel training as normal training (only specialized).

You have my sympathy. Apart from insurance, if the low time student pilots didn't ground loop them, the instructors probably would.

No IFR training in IMC.

That is NOT a Transport or insurance limitation. See above comment about choice of FTU. Note that during the winter, be prepared to pay for an aircraft with known icing equipment.

No operations on runways shorter than xxxx feet.

What's XXXX? Again, solo student ops might be expensive, but with an instructor, have at 'er.

Sounds like you need to switch FTU's.

[Ralliart]

Sounds like you need to switch FTU's

That would be my thought.

Try moving away from the large flight training hubs located alongside major cities and head out to the country a bit and I'm sure you'll find there are still quite a few schools who have a better grip on reality and are a little more flexible, allowing each individual instructor the means to work with the student and maximize training oppourtunity. A lot of these guys have good experience outside the FTU world, many times two-three-four times their experience inside instructing. Places like this do exist, you just have to do a little research and maybe drive a little longer to get there.

I'm flying 704 at the moment but I still work (casual part-time / second job) at a school with 4 instructors, 3 of whom are Class 2 (not that a 2 is automatically better than a 4) and all have minimum 500-1000 hrs charter experience, some with various multi operational flying experience. Everyone is paid well, and enjoys the instructional work they do. They instruct and fly operationally in the same day.

In regards to strong crosswinds, non-paved runways, "short" runways, we utilize these experiences whenever possible providing the overall weather, location, student ability, and need present itself.

Anyhow, you are the customer, just because Joe Blow runs a flying school 5 minutes from your house with 20 a/c and 30 instructors wearing epaulettes doesn't mean it's your best choice.

Cheers

[Krashman]

I'm the product of a system that put a lot of restrictions on when and where I could fly. I thought it was crazy on some days but those were the rules so I had no choice.

I'm an instructor now and a different school who's limits are more relaxed and I understand why those rules were put in place.

In the circuit I'll go dual with a student in marginal wx ie low ceilings or a good cross wind but would like to have those situations with the student dual and see how they handle it before I send them solo in it just for them to learn the conditions are too much for them to handle at their current stage.

That would be nice if students learnt there limits like that but as any other instructor would know. It very difficult to teach decision making.

The most dangerous situation is a student that doesn't know his limits/

Every one has limits... so do instructors

HEY HEDLEY

When I started as an instructor I couldn't handle a 15kt crosswind but now I can after experience. Good luck finding another instructor these days look and the posts.... every place is looking for instructors.

[water wings]

•No flying if temperature is colder than X degrees.

Most smart Charter ops working with pistons have cut offs, too... and after freezing a turbine last week, i can see why. My long-john and Parka limit is around the minus 40 mark, and thanks to a stop in YWG, i experienced that. Holy snap it was cold. They also have temp cut offs in case the pistons do give out, you want to be able to survive waiting for help - always dress for that, or at least carry your boots.


tailwheels need to make a comeback in flight training.

[dangerous]

Flight training is supposed to be an enjoyable and educational experience. It's true that some light piston trainers have minimum temperature limits, but they're usually pretty low. How can you expect to learn and have fun when you're freezing your nuts off doing the walkaround? In general, the planes can tolerate lower temperatures than my nuts. Therefore the lower temperature limits of piston aircraft are rarely a problem.

[Krashman]

I work at a flight school just south of YWG... our cut off is -27. Its pretty cold but thats not even including the wind chill. That where is gets really nasty.

[Hedley]

When I started as an instructor I couldn't handle a 15kt crosswind

How about we keep that a secret between us, and hope . doesn't read this and find out?

[Hedley]

Lead Sled: I may be wrong, but for little aeroplanes, the maximum demonstrated crosswind during certification is NOT a limiting factor with respect to (at least private) ops.

I know that FTU's need a "flight training program course outline" with these sort of limits spelled out in it, which gets more restrictive, but ...

IIRC the aircraft must demonstrate a crosswind component of 20% of the stall speed, but that is the only certification requirement wrt crosswinds.

Bottom line: if you privately own (say) a C172, and you land it with a 30 knot crosswind, that is NOT operating it outside of it's certification limits, even if Cessna only demonstrated a 15K x/wind during certification.

[Clodhopper]

I can understand some of those restrictions, as we have similar ones here at Peninsulair. Others are just outrageous.

•No "strong" crosswinds.
Our limit is 30+ for dual, 25 for rental pilots, and 20 for solo students (depending on skill) and the crosswind limits are max demo for dual (or higher at instructor's discretion), max demo for rental, and 10 for solo (depending on skill)
•No flying into grass or gravel fields.
We dont have any practical ones near Hamilton, the nearest being York, but its just about too short to use with the Cherokee, on anything but a nice windy dry day.
•No flying if temperature is colder than X degrees.
We have a -25C ambient temp limit, with wind chill at discretion of the pilot-in-command.
•No flying in Marginal VFR.
Dual not a problem, rental not a problem, solo has limits, but more for trainings' sake than anything else. Dual is good for the exposure for the student, and it doesnt help if you never show them what its like.
•No tailwheel training as normal training (only specialized).
Wish we had tailwheel. I use the Tomahawk to stress more rudder control, as its way touchier than the Cherokee in terms of hand-foot skill.
•No IFR training in IMC.
No biggie. We do it all the time, even in winter, as long as the temp and dewpoint wont bring icing. Then of course, if its MIFR training, you're kinda screwed for single-engine practice. Unless you want to land with one ice-cube.
•No operations on runways shorter than xxxx feet.
As long as its in the CFS, you have permission (if its grass you have to talk to the owner and/or CFI), and the performance can handle it, go ahead. We use 2000 to 2500 foot runways all the time with the Cherokee. Even take off from taxiway Charlie on runway 24, 2100 ft, its easy. Again, you need it for training purposes...otherwise they try it themselves once licenced and pooch it.

Again, as others have posted, these limits are for insurance and Transport Canada purposes for operating a flight school and renting aircraft. Unfortunately its all about covering your butt...