It would appear that things are going from bad to worse for the LCC's in the EU or is this the beginning of the end..Whatever it's a mess perhaps in the past this also went on but no one knew about it. However now a days we have the power of the internet and are much better informed, hopefully we will use this tool wisely to put an end to such management tactics..
Danny aka Capt PPRuNe
posted 28th August 2004 23:47
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ryanair Vs BALPA/IALPA
It must surely never be the intention of a reasonable employer to censure free debate amongst its employees, of terms, conditions and potential union representation. Therefore, this thread WILL continue along those lines and those lines alone.
This post is to advise readers of the current position of PPRuNe with regard to the temporarily withdrawn thread regarding Ryanair, as well as opening a channel for debate to be carried out under specific conditions.
Firstly, the removed thread is still under review by PPRuNe and it remains our intention to return it to the public domain once it has been ensured that anything which leaves PPRuNe open to legal action has been removed or edited. Unfortunately, due to personal circumstances, I have little access to the Internet at the moment and I am only able to view the thread, and assess it, on an opportunity basis. Please be assured that it will return, and will in all probability be merged with this and other threads to ensure that the full story about Ryanair and BALPA/IALPA, as well as the interface with PPRuNe, becomes known.
You may use this thread to continue the debate and the flow of information about these issues. The following guidelines however, MUST be adhered to when making a post.
1. Please make sure that posts stick only to the issues detailed below.
2. Do not engage in immature rants or point scoring. Certainly, do not lower yourself to imitating the behaviour of anyone that disagrees with you or is from the opposite camp.
3. Post in a constructive, calm, and considered manner. There is no need for partisan, colourful, and abusive language to make your point. Let your reasoned arguments make your point for you, not your emotion.
4. Please keep your posts to factual information. For example, it would be appropriate to discuss letters which staff have received which might be construed as bullying or harassment, the perceived erosion of terms and conditions, the tactics and methods being used by Ryanair or indeed BALPA/IALPA, differing contracts for different pilot groups, and planned fleet changes. This list is not exhaustive, but indicates things that are probably solid knowledge to those involved and are worthy of a reasoned debate and exchange of information and views.
5. Do not make personal accusations, particularly involving the private lives of any of the players. See point 3 for tips on how to make your argument.
6. If engaging in discussion about an airline's safety record, then please ensure that it involves only known and published incidents. Speculation or interpolation is not only possibly painting an untrue picture, it can also be damaging to the airline and its reputation. Most of important of all, it can be distressing to the crews, who will always be striving to do their jobs in the safest manner possible. Remember that the first person to arrive at the scene of an air accident will always be the pilots! Self-preservation makes a safe operation a very high priority for anyone flying.
Whilst PPRuNe is, after all, only a collection of anonymous scribbles on a toilet wall, and thus in all probability worthless and a waste of time (according to the CEO of a Low Cost Irish airline), it is interesting that people in this industry do occasionally see it as a threat and will take steps to try and stifle debate where possible. By sticking to the guidance given above, PPRuNe hopes that we will not provide anyone with a legal reason to prevent the issues being discussed. Please bear this in mind and note that any post not complying with our advice will be subject to immediate removal without recourse to an explanation. Anything we think or feel may put PPRuNe under legal threat, we reserve the right to remove at our sole behest.
PPRuNe appreciates your co-operation, as well as your literary contributions, to help make this industry a strong and healthy one no matter what the hardships that are placed upon it and those who work in it. Ryanair management will no doubt agree with the right of their workers to free association, which we are facilitating with the caveats previously mentioned.
On a final note, and I haven't seen this published anywhere else yet, it has been rumoured that Ryanair have finalised a deal with a US company to take all their -200 series B737's starting with immediate effect. The last aircraft to leave the fleet are supposed to be the Dublin based aircraft and it is expected that they will be gone by May 2005. How this information will affect those long standing pilots based in Dublin is anyone's guess but with the alleged threat of no conversions to the -800 unless they ditch the idea of unionisation, may well put extra pressure on them.
Ryanair Vs BALPA/IALPA
Moderators: sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, North Shore
Don't tar all the LCC with the same brush. Ryanair (and it's CEO MOL) is indeed the worst of the lot, and indeed everyone hears about it thanks to the internet. They give the whole sector a bad name; partly through their size and their continuous publicity.
At last count there were over 50 LCC's in Europe; of which a lot are going to disappear.
At last count there were over 50 LCC's in Europe; of which a lot are going to disappear.
