New License Applications Available

[Stevo226]

I'm not sure if this has been posted recently:
Applications for the new license binder or whatever are available now, heard through the grapevine that the paper licenses will no longer be valid as of March 1 2009. They are currently accepting applications for CPL and ATPL only. This first one is free, anybody want to wager a guess as to how much they'll charge in a few years?

My guess is a modest processing fee of $150

Anyway, here's the form: http://www.tc.gc.ca/wwwdocs/Forms/26-07 ... -01_BO.pdf

[CD]

Discussed here:

AvCanada: Question about new Licence Booklet

[Chuck Ellsworth]

I have a question.

My medical has just expired again and I haven't had a chance to renew it.

When my medical expires I still can fly with PPL privileges so if I applied with an expired medical what licenses would they send me, an ATPL fixed wing and a Commercial rotary wing or a PPL?

[Carrier]

Here’s the response received when I tried the link in the first post:


“To view the full contents of this document, you need a later version of the PDF viewer. You can upgrade
to the latest version of Adobe Reader from www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/readstep2.html

For further support, go to www.adobe.com/support/products/acrreader.html”


Naturally my software is all up to date! I checked earlier today using Software Update and was advised that I have the latest versions of everything on the computer. In any case, TC should recognise that not everyone has the latest version or all of the exotic plug-ins. It should be common sense to maintain the TC site at a fairly low technical level to accommodate those who use older computers and software. The TC site should be accessible to ALL Internet users, not just geeks who have all the latest goodies! Of course such a level of consideration and customer service seems to be foreign to TC.

[AUGER9]

What they should do is mail out the application forms. Most of the pilots I talk to know nothing about this.

[k411]

Here’s the response received when I tried the link in the first post:


“To view the full contents of this document, you need a later version of the PDF viewer. You can upgrade
to the latest version of Adobe Reader from http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/readstep2.html

For further support, go to http://www.adobe.com/support/products/acrreader.html”


Naturally my software is all up to date! I checked earlier today using Software Update and was advised that I have the latest versions of everything on the computer. In any case, TC should recognise that not everyone has the latest version or all of the exotic plug-ins. It should be common sense to maintain the TC site at a fairly low technical level to accommodate those who use older computers and software. The TC site should be accessible to ALL Internet users, not just geeks who have all the latest goodies! Of course such a level of consideration and customer service seems to be foreign to TC.

...Almost any form etc, especially gov't forms are in PDF form nowadays...

[flying4dollars]

What they should do is mail out the application forms. Most of the pilots I talk to know nothing about this.

that would cost THEM money though...

it should be US that have to pay for everything...including processing fees...

[Chuck Ellsworth]

Applications for the new license binder or whatever are available now, heard through the grapevine that the paper licenses will no longer be valid as of March 1 2009.

So suppose you apply for the new license in the second week of April and they don't get your new license delivered to you are you supposed to quit flying until it arrives?

[Proline]

Well .,

What happens when you book a medical the day before you expire, and you can't get an appointment for a week????? Same thing man, learn some responsibility.

[Chuck Ellsworth]

Well .,

What happens when you book a medical the day before you expire, and you can't get an appointment for a week????? Same thing man, learn some responsibility.

Learn some responsibility????

What kind of a stupid statement is that?

If the deadline is Mar 01 how is applying for the license a couple of weeks before the deadline irresponsible?

Or are one of those people who think that just because the government comes out with some new format of a license you will somehow not be safe flying without it if they can't get it to you in a couple of weeks?

So tell me Proline if you applied a couple of weeks before the deadline and you didn't get the thing in your hands by the deadline would you not go to work if you were flying for a living?

[Proline]

hmm hard to say, probably not if it's illegal. Don't know how clients would take to that if I were to get ramped and told the flight was grounded due to improper documentation. It's the Gov't, why would you wait to apply two weeks before.
You seem to have alot of time on your hands why don't ya just apply now. Save yourself the trouble. Is all I am saying.

[Chuck Ellsworth]

hmm hard to say, probably not if it's illegal. Don't know how clients would take to that if I were to get ramped and told the flight was grounded due to improper documentation.

That is what I am driving at, if you had proof you had applied for said license several weeks before the deadline how could you be grounded by someone ramp checking you?

Or are you Canadains so cowed by your regulator you live in fear of being caught without a piece of paper you had applied for before the deadline?

All I am doing is pointing out that the system is getting so screwed up it is beyond hope.

Of course in Canada you do not have access to a real court if you get grounded for something such as this...

I was fortunate not to have had to put up with this type of petty B.S for the last part of my career ......

[Strega]

hmm hard to say, probably not if it's illegal. Don't know how clients would take to that if I were to get ramped and told the flight was grounded due to improper documentation. It's the Gov't, why would you wait to apply two weeks before.
You seem to have alot of time on your hands why don't ya just apply now. Save yourself the trouble. Is all I am saying.

Why wouldnt you?

Let me guess, you're from Ontario....

[E-Flyer]

What they should do is mail out the application forms. Most of the pilots I talk to know nothing about this.

Niether did I until I saw this post.

[k411]

Just read the website, and apparently it costs the same as the old liscenses...

Will this booklet cost me anything?

No. The only cost that you will incur will be the cost of obtaining a passport photograph from a commercial photographer and mailing cost of your application form.

The current fee schedule for Personnel Licensing and Training remains in effect for applicants for new licences, permits and ratings.

[. ._]

I edited my reply because it deals with our awesome regulator, whom I love dearly. I wish nothing more than to comply with whatever they dictate.

[Carrier]

k411, My up to date software opens pdf forms from all sorts of websites. My company sends out crew schedules and other documents in pdf format. There is no problem with opening any of these pdf forms. It works well. The only one that will not open is the form from the Transport Canada site. I noticed in another thread that someone else also found this TC form would not open. That indicates that there is something wrong with TC’s version/site! They need to sort it out and put their forms in a format/version that is accessible to ALL Internet users.

The alternative as suggested by other posters is that TC should mail out the forms and all other information if they are unable to get their website to operate to the levels of convenience and customer service that others have shown to be both possible and practical.

Edited to add: Further to my posts above, I used the link on the other thread to go to the TCCA web page for Flight Crew Licensing Application Forms. On there are the links for all of the appropriate forms which are in pdf format. I tried them all. They all open except for the first one - the Application for Aviation Document Booklet, which every time gives me the message posted above. Obviously there is something wrong with this particular link/document. What does it take to get them to correct the problem with this particular link/document?

[Vimana]

hmm hard to say, probably not if it's illegal. Don't know how clients would take to that if I were to get ramped and told the flight was grounded due to improper documentation. It's the Gov't, why would you wait to apply two weeks before.
You seem to have alot of time on your hands why don't ya just apply now. Save yourself the trouble. Is all I am saying.

Why wouldnt you?

Let me guess, you're from Ontario....

Not very nice Strega

[Proline]

Nope not from Ontario........Whatever thats supposed to mean, I just don't see the point in stressing myself out about somthing I can't control. What I meant about the Gov't is everything they do takes along time, why would you wait until the last minute.....

[Chuck Ellsworth]

What I meant about the Gov't is everything they do takes along time, why would you wait until the last minute.....

There could be many reasons why someone would not apply until just prior to the deadline.

The question is if you have applied before the deadline and TC does not get the new document to you and you have proof you have complied before the deadline I do not see how they could ground you over something as insignificant as a paper work change in a valid license.

[k411]

What I meant about the Gov't is everything they do takes along time, why would you wait until the last minute.....

There could be many reasons why someone would not apply until just prior to the deadline.

The question is if you have applied before the deadline and TC does not get the new document to you and you have proof you have complied before the deadline I do not see how they could ground you over something as insignificant as a paper work change in a valid license.

... Its no different than if any other liscense were to expire, and you waited till just prior to the deadline, be it your drivers liscense, passport, etc, its all the same, its just everyones liscense is expiring all at once and thats when the change is happening.

[Carrier]

Quote: “its just everyones liscense is expiring all at once and thats when the change is happening.”

TC knows that since they caused it! They have an obligation to serve the customers, not to inconvenience them. They are in their jobs to serve us and their salaries are paid by us. They should therefore do what any competent private sector operation would do and arrange the process (and the end product) to be convenient and trouble free for the customers.

Here are some suggestions:

1 Stagger the applications. Have say A-B processed in January, C-E in February, etc., so mail out the application forms and reply paid envelopes in monthly batches.

2 Take on extra temporary staff if they want to do it all in one month.

3 Go to the same credit card size licence with photo as the USA. No extra cost will be involved since the FAA has already done all the research and come up with a practical format. Why reinvent the wheel? All TC has to do is copy it. I expect the FAA will be more than willing to help its less capable neighbour! New photos would not be needed since our electronic photos are already on record for drivers' licences and Big Brother already has the pics of those of us who hold Canadian passports. TC could arrange with Passport Canada or the provinces to use the same photos and to have the verification of identity done at provincial drivers' licence offices or Service Canada offices, or would that be too simple and far too much like customer service?

There, what’s so difficult about the above? All it takes is a little bit of thought and some consideration for others - the customers and the taxpayers. In either case TC should mail out to all licence holders application forms with reply paid envelopes.


At the beginning of the thread "New Licence Format" I note that the first two posters both had the same problem with accessing the form on the TC website. Does anyone at TC read this and know when the problem will be corrected? Also, why are the dimensions of the new booklet not posted on the TC website along with all the other drivel? Does TC have something to hide? In view of all the controversy about the size of this booklet I would have expected TC to post the dimensions and offer some sort of defence of them!

[AUGER9]

Also, why are the dimensions of the new booklet not posted on the TC website along with all the other drivel? Does TC have something to hide? In view of all the controversy about the size of this booklet I would have expected TC to post the dimensions and offer some sort of defence of them!

Actually, http://www.tc.gc.ca/civilaviation/gener ... faq.htm#q6 .

6. What are the dimensions of the new booklet?
The dimensions of the booklet are 88mm x 125mm....
In comparison, the dimensions of the wallet you used to buy from your local aviation store measures about 80mm x 115mm.

[CD]

How many threads have we got going on this issue now?

Someone already posted the link on another thread but here is the information on the size:

6. What are the dimensions of the new booklet?

The dimensions of the booklet are 88mm x 125mm. These dimensions are governed by ICAO document 9303 standards for machine-readable travel documents. Transport Canada decided to go with the machine-readable format (passport type) to allow for easy readability for humans and machines. In comparison, the dimensions of the wallet you used to buy from your local aviation store measures about 80mm x 115mm.

FAQ - Aviation Document Booklet

As to who to contact regarding the .pdf document, here are three options:

Licensing Office Contacts
Civil Aviation Issues Reporting System
Civil Aviation Communications Centre

[Chuck Ellsworth]

TC knows that since they caused it! They have an obligation to serve the customers, not to inconvenience them.

Unfortunately TC could care less about inconveniencing us.

Funny thing about their methods of communicating with us when I was in the process of applying for my last OC every time they communicated with me it was by mail which of course takes up to a week to go from one city to another, so time to these people has no meaning nor does the cost of dealing with them.

I love all the platitudes about one needing to just suck it up and comply with every wacky idea these people dream up.

Ah well I guess that is all part of being in aviation in this country.

It would be interesting to see what they will do if they find someone without the new license after the due date, for sure it is a lot easier to penalize someone for that than go out and police the operators who operate outside of the rules.