YYC closure last night? (Dec 21)

[silentivan]

I heard something about YYC closing late last night due to crappy wx? Things were fine (as fine as they can be at -30) up in YEG, so I'm just wondering if this is true, or some mental hallucination I dreamt up.

[E-Flyer]

I heard something about YYC closing late last night due to crappy wx? Things were fine (as fine as they can be at -30) up in YEG, so I'm just wondering if this is true, or some mental hallucination I dreamt up.

Well from what I know, most YVR - YYC flights are canceled today... so that probably is right.

[5x5]

Here's the weather - call it yourself.

CYYC 221800Z 34014KT 8SM -SN DRSN BKN042 OVC051 M21/M26 A2984 RMK SC6SC2 /S02/ SLP210
CYYC 221700Z 33015KT 3SM -SN DRSN BKN023 OVC041 M21/M26 A2983 RMK SN4SC2SC2 SLP207
CYYC 221624Z 33017KT 3SM -SN DRSN BKN017 OVC040 M21/ RMK SN4SC2SC2
CYYC 221611Z 34015KT 1 1/2SM -SN DRSN BKN015 BKN022 OVC032 M22/ RMK SN4SC2SC1SC1
CYYC 221600Z 34015KT 5/8SM -SN DRSN BKN009 BKN018 OVC036 M22/M26 A2982 RESN RMK SN6SC1SC1SC1 RVR RWY16 6000 FT /S01/ SLP203
CYYC 221513Z 34015KT 1/2SM SN DRSN BKN007 OVC022 M22/ RMK SN6SC1SC1 RVR RWY16 6000 FT
CYYC 221500Z 34017KT 1 1/2SM -SN DRSN BKN010 OVC021 M22/M26 A2982 RMK SN6SC2SC1 SLP203
CYYC 221446Z 34018G24KT 2SM -SN DRSN BKN011 OVC023 M22/ RMK SC6SC2
CYYC 221400Z 34016KT 3SM -SN BKN030 OVC090 M22/M26 A2981 RMK SC4AC4 SLP199
CYYC 221338Z 34018KT 5SM -SN BKN015 OVC030 M22/ RMK SC4SC4
CYYC 221300Z 34015KT 1 1/2SM -SN BKN020 OVC050 M21/M26 A2981 RMK SC4SC4 SLP198
CYYC 221200Z CCA 35014KT 1 1/2SM -SN BKN015 OVC030 M21/M25 A2981 RMK SC5SC3 SNOW CVR/ MUCH LOOSE SLP198
CYYC 221100Z 34014KT 3SM -SN OVC040 M22/M26 A2980 RMK SC8 SLP198
CYYC 221000Z 34015KT 1 1/2SM -SN OVC035 M22/M26 A2980 RMK SC8 SLP196
CYYC 220900Z 35007KT 1 1/2SM -SN OVC030 M22/M25 A2979 RMK SC8 SLP194
CYYC 220836Z 36006KT 1 1/2SM -SN OVC030 M22/ RMK SC8
CYYC 220800Z 34006KT 8SM -SN BKN035 OVC080 M23/M26 A2979 RMK SC7AC1 SLP196
CYYC 220751Z 36006KT 5SM -SN BKN040 OVC080 M23/ RMK SC7AC1
CYYC 220700Z 03004KT 1 1/2SM -SN OVC020 M22/M26 A2978 RMK SC8 SLP194
CYYC 220624Z 09006KT 1 1/2SM -SN OVC015 M22/ RMK SC8
CYYC 220600Z CCB 09005KT 1SM -SN BKN009 OVC018 M22/M25 A2978 RMK SC6SC2 RVR RWY 16 6000+ FT /SO1/ SLP194
CYYC 220549Z 09004KT 1SM -SN BKN008 OVC020 M22/ RMK SC6SC2
CYYC 220500Z 11007KT 1SM -SN BKN010 OVC025 M21/M24 A2979 RMK SC6SC2 SLP202
CYYC 220400Z 13006KT 1 1/2SM -SN BKN015 OVC040 M21/M24 A2980 RMK SC6SC2 SLP204
CYYC 220300Z 13007KT 1SM -SN BKN010 OVC025 M20/M24 A2982 RMK SC6SC2 SLP209
CYYC 220220Z 14008KT 2 1/2SM -SN BKN012 OVC020 M20/ RMK SC5SC3
CYYC 220200Z 12008KT 2 1/2SM -SN FEW010 BKN020 OVC050 M19/M23 A2983 RMK SC2SC5SC1 SLP219
CYYC 220143Z 14007KT 2 1/2SM -SN FEW010 BKN020 OVC050 M19/ RMK SC2SC2SC3
CYYC 220118Z 16012KT 2 1/2SM -SN BKN010 OVC040 M19/ RMK SC5SC3
CYYC 220106Z 16012KT 2 1/2SM -SN FEW010 SCT020 OVC040 M19/ RMK SC1SC2SC5
CYYC 220100Z 17010KT 15SM SCT042 OVC060 M19/M23 A2985 RMK SC3SC5 SLP227
CYYC 220000Z 14007KT 15SM SCT060 OVC080 M20/M24 A2988 RMK SC4AC4 SLP234
CYYC 212300Z 14010KT 40SM FEW062 BKN080 M20/M24 A2990 RMK SC1AC7 SLP246
CYYC 212200Z 18013KT 40SM FEW080 BKN100 OVC120 M19/M25 A2992 RMK AC2AC2AC2 SLP252
CYYC 212100Z 17011KT 40SM FEW084 BKN120 M21/M27 A2994 RMK AC2AC2 SLP260
CYYC 212000Z 17010G15KT 40SM SCT084 BKN100 M21/M27 A2998 RMK AC4AC3 SLP277

[Dave T]

I got into YYC very late last night/early this morning. It was snowing and the runway was pretty slick but nothing to crazy. Now YVR on the other hand. I spent 4.5 hours on the ground there waiting to get deiced. That was a total gong show.

[silentivan]

Yeah, pretty much anything to do with YVR, or YYZ for that matter, are going to be backed up for the next week or so. Too bad....it really makes life miserable for everyone. Pilots, pax, rampies, fuellers, dispatchers, atc, lav flushers.

5x5, where did you find the past 20 odd hours worth of metars?

[nimbostratus]

I landed in YYC around 8:30 pm last night. It was fine. Light snow, over a mile vis. Better weather here in Calgary than the weather was when we departed Seattle! De-icing gong show as well. The "wet" coast gets hung up when it snows, especially this early in the season.

Nimbo

[denlou]

It's heresay, but I hear YVR has enough snow plows for one runway, so that's the holdup.

I was on a Westjet flight connecting from YYC to YVR and we were in the plane waiting for our slot time in YVR when they cancelled the flight because the Westjet before us circled YVR for 30 mins before deciding to turn back because they couldn't get in.

[Dave T]

YVR was only using the North runway and was opening and closing it for plowing in roughly 30-40 minute intervals. Closed 30 minutes, open 30 minutes.

[jspitfire]

I was one of the lucky few that got into YVR last night from YEG. Took about 30 mins to taxi from the runway to the gate. Pretty ugly stuff.

[E-Flyer]

I was one of the lucky few that got into YVR last night from YEG. Took about 30 mins to taxi from the runway to the gate. Pretty ugly stuff.

Here's an interesting food for thought.

Why is it that Air Canada cancelled it's flight from EGLL... yet BAW and KLM who are on the same respective route did not cancel their flight? they arrive within 4 hour parameters apart. What would be the decision that would lead to one airline saying no, and the other 2 saying yes? From what I see... a bunch of other flights were cancelled during the arrival time of BAW and KLM... so hmmm ??

[E-Flyer]

It's heresay, but I hear YVR has enough snow plows for one runway, so that's the holdup.

I was on a Westjet flight connecting from YYC to YVR and we were in the plane waiting for our slot time in YVR when they cancelled the flight because the Westjet before us circled YVR for 30 mins before deciding to turn back because they couldn't get in.

ouch that has got to hurt - I assume you didn't get paid since u hadn't been using flight time All those 3 s's and being at the airport earlier for nothing ).

Sucks !

[wallypilot]

YVR's problem is lack of snow removal equipment. If they could have kept more taxiways plowed and both runways open, even with the 30 minute closures every hour, their capacity for arrivals, at least would have been somewhat better. Of course for departures, the limited deicing capacity is a totally different beast.

Our flight was the first one in after one of the 30 min closures, and it was eerie how quiet the radio was, and how empty the TCAS screen was.

[E-Flyer]

YVR's problem is lack of snow removal equipment. If they could have kept more taxiways plowed and both runways open, even with the 30 minute closures every hour, their capacity for arrivals, at least would have been somewhat better. Of course for departures, the limited deicing capacity is a totally different beast.

Our flight was the first one in after one of the 30 min closures, and it was eerie how quiet the radio was, and how empty the TCAS screen was.

I guess maybe they didn't want to send the 767 over from EGLL because they may run into contingency fuel with all the delays and hold ups? yet the A330 and 744 have no problem...

I don't know, i just found it interesting how 1 plane out of 3 on the same respective route cancelled their flight.

[arctic navigator]

if they're opening one side for 30 mins at a time would alternating north and south sides work to keep things flowing without completely closing the airport?

[E-Flyer]

if they're opening one side for 30 mins at a time would alternating north and south sides work to keep things flowing without completely closing the airport?

are the precision approaches available for both runways? I thought one was U/S not too long ago?

[Lommer]

Air Canada really shit the bed at YVR in the past 48 hrs. I heard various stories ranging from running out of deicing fluid to negligable ramp manpower, but the upshot is that many AC flights were cancelled, and many of their contract customers for ground handling/deicing were hung out to dry. Other ops at YVR have been a mess with only the north runway open/closed on 30 minute rotations. YVR to their credit has had tons of plows going, but it really doesn't help when they start taking out runway lights (thus closing the runway 'til they're fixed). Also when they can't finish plowing a gate before flights arrive and there's big lines of snow criss-crossing the gate it makes it impossible to turn a plane on time, as most ramp equipment isn't built for 4x4ing.

Ah snow days...

[V2-OMG!]

If Air Canada is shitting the bed, WestJet is urinating all over it because their computers crashed yesterday, and people have been waiting for two days just to get out of Edmonton. Some of the other poor schmucks have been waiting in line for eight hours, then get bumped just as they are stepping up to the counter.

Am just watching the news - total chaos at YVR. People crying and sobbing, "I won't get home for Christmas." Air Canada has TWO people at the counter to handle this?? One exasperated couple from Australia are trying to get to Calgary - finally said screw the airlines, and are going to rent a car and drive through the Rockies. Good-luck mate!

Too bad, but no one anticipated this on the west coast. This is the first memory I have of a white Christmas at YVR. The doomdayers are screaming, "What if this happens during he Winter Olympics?" Well, it could be a balmy 12C. next February -- and they'll be screaming for snow.

Maybe those trying to "get home for Christmas" will try getting away a bit earlier next year?? I don't have a lot of sympathy for those who left it up to the last minute, then think they are going to step onto any plane like they are stepping into an elevator. After all, it's the middle of winter....and this is CANADA!

[ybp]

I am not trying to be a troll, but just think what this would be like if it WASN'T for global warming?

[E-Flyer]

If Air Canada is shitting the bed, WestJet is urinating all over it because their computers crashed yesterday, and people have been waiting for two days just to get out of Edmonton. Some of the other poor schmucks have been waiting in line for eight hours, then get bumped just as they are stepping up to the counter.

Am just watching the news - total chaos at YVR. People crying and sobbing, "I won't get home for Christmas." Air Canada has TWO people at the counter to handle this?? One exasperated couple from Australia are trying to get to Calgary - finally said screw the airlines, and are going to rent a car and drive through the Rockies. Good-luck mate!

Too bad, but no one anticipated this on the west coast. This is the first memory I have of a white Christmas at YVR. The doomdayers are screaming, "What if this happens during he Winter Olympics?" Well, it could be a balmy 12C. next February -- and they'll be screaming for snow.

Maybe those trying to "get home for Christmas" will try getting away a bit earlier next year?? I don't have a lot of sympathy for those who left it up to the last minute, then think they are going to step onto any plane like they are stepping into an elevator. After all, it's the middle of winter....and this is CANADA!

I just have one thing to say - canadians shouldn't be proud of them selves... if you call your self "Air Canada" or "canadian" and can't deal with snowy weather there's seriously something wrong with you. Snow is part of our culture ain't it? being able to deal with it is something that is in our blood. Being able to deal with snowy weather should be second nature. How come ESSA doesn't run into these kinds of delays? EDDF? LOWW? LSZH? ... The traffic Load in EDDF is much more than CYVR.

I can see how YVR being on the west side and not getting so much snow could be an issue... but YYC ? YYZ ? ... these are the snow capitals of our country.

Oh and at least WJA returned the full refund of the passengers tickets or gave them double credits... they know how to keep passengers satisfied.


C'mon !

[swordfish]

Silentvan enquired:

5x5, where did you find the past 20 odd hours worth of metars?

You can get up to 36 hours' METARS (and TAF of course) from the ADDS site (add the C- for Canadian abbreviators):
http://adds.aviationweather.noaa.gov/metars/

E-flyer wondered:

How come ESSA doesn't run into these kinds of delays?

Have you ever flown there? The Swedish controllers ROCK, dude. You hardly ever get a hold, they are courteous, and ground deicing is done by LFV (equivalent of TC here) who have the equipment and facilities to handle the load. I never had to return to the gate to get redone; they all have their shit together at Arlanda.

[E-Flyer]

I was born in Uppsala and lived there for a long time of my life.

[V2-OMG!]

I just have one thing to say - canadians shouldn't be proud of them selves... if you call your self "Air Canada" or "canadian" and can't deal with snowy weather there's seriously something wrong with you. Snow is part of our culture ain't it? being able to deal with it is something that is in our blood. Being able to deal with snowy weather should be second nature. How come ESSA doesn't run into these kinds of delays? EDDF? LOWW? LSZH? ... The traffic Load in EDDF is much more than CYVR.

I can see how YVR being on the west side and not getting so much snow could be an issue... but YYC ? YYZ ? ... these are the snow capitals of our country.

Oh and at least WJA returned the full refund of the passengers tickets or gave them double credits... they know how to keep passengers satisfied.
C'mon !

Did not mean to get on the anti-WJ or anti-Air Canada bandwagon. Each airline has its challenges during this snowzilla at YVR. As I write this, Air Canada has just cancelled all "short and medium-haul" flights in and out of Vancouver to devote all resources to its cross-Canada/international flights. WJ seems to be doing okay - but then, it's what they specialize in - those short/medium flights. It takes a lot longer to de-ice a B777 vs. a B737.

Agree with your comment about poor forsight weather-wise, corporately and individually.

[3Green]

if you call your self "Air Canada" or "canadian" and can't deal with snowy weather there's seriously something wrong with you.

Get off your moms computer and get a pilots license, work your way through the industry and get to the point where you are in the beak of an AC/WJ flight and have to make the "go/no-go" decision based on weather and your Ops Specs. THEN you might have the right to come on here, or ANY forum, and blast a company for something you currently know nothing about.
Merry f^&%$g Christmas.

This is getting absolutely disgusting.

[E-Flyer]

I have a pilot's license.

You truly make your company look good 3green, using the word @#$! in front of the word christ is disgusting if you ask me - merry christmas to you too.

May the years of flying teach you a little bit about morale.

[wallypilot]

I am not trying to be a troll, but just think what this would be like if it WASN'T for global warming?

actually, one of the things that the scientists predicted with global warming is that the pacific northwest would get slightly cooler and wetter for a while with more extreme swings from warm to cool. So far this fall/winter, that is the weather perfectly. Until Dec 12, we had unseasonably warm weather...then the swing to arctic outflow cool winds, then significant snow the last couple days.