Fatigue Research

[Widow]

I've recently been contacted by someone who is doing research on fatigue in the aviation industry. Specifically, this person is looking for evidence regarding the efficiency or inefficiency of current regulations about fatigue. Time is of the essence and the evidence could be specific to any aviation sector - such as Medevacs or AMEs. If you can, and are willing to help, please contact me by PM or email.

[CD]

There has been so much published in the last few years regarding this issue that it's quite difficult to summarize what's available... for example:

Independent Scientific Study is Severe on Current European Air Crew Fatigue Rules
Fatigue in air traffic controllers: Literature review
Flight Attendant Fatigue
Assessment of Aircraft Maintenance Engineers (AMEs) Hours of Work: Phase 1
Centre for Sleep Research: Applied Research
Drew Dawson: Reports and Papers
Fatigue Countermeasures Group
Too Tired To Fly?

Your contact who is doing research might need to narrow the focus or be more specific in exactly what information they are seeking.

[sky's the limit]

27 straight, 150flt hrs in 30

5 off then 42 straight, 210flt hrs in 42

14hr duty days extendable to 15hrs....


Yes, we have a big problem with fatigue.

stl

[Changes in Latitudes]

I'd be very hesitant to provide information to individuals "doing studies" or looking to expose things without being provided some seriously thorough background information first. Many of us saw the latest episode of The 5th Estate.

A few years ago I was contacted by a publication to provide information on a particular aviation "hot item". After going through the questions posed to me, I could tell I was being led down a road with an already drawn conclusion. A conclusion that although had some merit, was skewed, overridden with bias and was essentially formed to provide a headline that would sell the publication based on scare tactics alone.

Can we make improvements in our business? Absolutely, we need to make some serious adjustments and we can always do better. I am definitely on board in regards to that endeavour, and work with people whose goals are to do just that. But I'm not going to be the guy to bulldoze the entire house when just the kitchen needs refinishing.

[armchair]

http://www.tc.gc.ca/civilaviation/sms/frms/menu.htm

[Brown Bear]

The present regulations regarding flight duty times were written for the operators, NOT the crews.
14 hours....truck drivers can only go 10!
The days that a crew can go on fires is quite insane. Lots of folks can fill you in on that stat.....Driving Rain? CL Guy?
Kind of hard to "call duty time" when you're in an absolute shit hole like YPM!

[Rockie]

[/color]

http://www.tc.gc.ca/civilaviation/sms/frms/menu.htm

This is all great stuff designed solely to relieve Transport Canada of the responsibility for protecting the travelling public. No doubt there will be some good stuff in there, but what it really comes down to is this:

Fitness of Flight Crew Members

602.02 No operator of an aircraft shall require any person to act as a flight crew member and no person shall act as a flight crew member, if either the person or the operator has any reason to believe, having regard to the circumstances of the particular flight to be undertaken, that the person

(a) is suffering or is likely to suffer from fatigue; or

(b) is otherwise unfit to perform properly the person's duties as a flight crew member.

At the end of the day the only protection you will get is what you provide yourself by complying with this. If everybody did that industry would have to get serious about it. But don't ever count on the regulator in this country to do it for you.

[sky's the limit]

!
The days that a crew can go on fires is quite insane. Lots of folks can fill you in on that stat.....Driving Rain? CL Guy?

Fires are tame, most agencies, BCFS/AFS etc, impose restrictions above and beyond CARS on flight crews making it generally "bankers hours" as we like to call it. On "industry" jobs you are pushed to the 14hrs limit every day without fail, up to 42 days straight making life many times more difficult in terms of fatigue management.

Sure, I can quote CAR 602.02 until I'm blue in the face - but I'll be doing it at home without a helicopter to fly, that is the harsh reality of it.

stl

[bezerker]

I would say that anyone on 24 hour call "is suffering or is likely to suffer from fatigue" while flying if they have been without sleep for more than 14 hours (and even more so at the end of a 12+ hour duty day that began after 16-18 hours of no sleep).

Why this is not enforced is a good question.

As STL said, if you mention to your employer that you are fatigued or that you were not able to sleep for 8 hours during the day (even though you just did 2 all nighters in a row), you will soon be without a paycheck.

It would be very simple to audit this (if TC still did audits).

I hate to sidetrack the topic but I ponder how SMS will deal with issues such as this. And by issues such as this I mean how will SMS improve safety for companies that take advantage of current loopholes in the CAR's, or stretch the interpretation to the limit, or treat every CAR as an absolute minimum to be complied with. What happens when an employee files a report that says "myself and other crew members are frequently sleeping while en route despite our best efforts to be properly rested before flight"? Asides from firing the employee when the company figures out who filed the report, SMS will do jack squat to change anything that the employer currently feels is adequate. To continue with my rant here, how anyone in their right mind believes that companies that monitor themselves will add anything whatsoever to safety has been flying on a different planet than I have.

Like many other issues, duty times and pilot fatigue are 100% economic. It is so easy to reduce fatigue, you simply need more crew. Logic dictates that economic decisions and safety issues can not and must not be dealt with by the same person, as they have opposite goals, one is to save money and the other is to spend it. And I don't need to hear the argument "if you think safety is expensive, try an accident" because many operators are content to ride on a very high level of risk for as long as possible.

Anyway, end of rant. Unfortunately the industry must have powerful lobbies, as nothing has been done about this for years. It is a long road ahead when we can't get TC to enforce regulations that are already in place.

[Flybabe]

I think bezer sums it up quite nicely.

[Chuck Ellsworth]

As TC moves further and further from direct contact with and over sight of the industry has their number of employees been reduced to reflect their lack of hands on contact?

Someone must have the stats on this issue?

[bezerker]

Well ., from the article in The Walrus that Kirsten posted:

Last year, the Auditor General of Canada, Sheila Fraser, examined Transport Canada’s handling of air transportation safety. In her annual report to Parliament in May 2008, blah, blah, blah...

Fraser later told a parliamentary committee that “Transport Canada could not demonstrate to us that it is carrying out a sufficient number of inspections during the transition.” She also noted that the number of inspectors and engineers in the department has decreased by 8 percent in the past five years, that “Transport Canada has not yet identified how many inspectors and engineers it needs, with what competencies, during and after the transition,” and that there is a “risk that the Department will not be able to recruit the people it needs in a timely manner.”

So, by my math, close to 8% less inspectors than what was used in 2003. And I just read in the new Wings issue that air traffic is expected to grow by 40% by 2013.

So, all in all, it is very hard to determine if we have enough inspectors or not. (sarcasm)

[Chuck Ellsworth]

” She also noted that the number of inspectors and engineers in the department has decreased by 8 percent in the past five years,"

That may be a fact however what I was trying to find out is has the number of employees at TC been reduced by 8 percent in the past five years, or is it just a reduction of inspectors?

Or to put another way is their bureaucracy shrinking as time passes?

[co-joe]

Working typical aviation shifts, my immune system took a shit kicking. I used to be sick virtually all the time. Medevacs beat me up something awful. I was always just getting something or just getting over something nasty. Flues, head colds, major chest infections, you name it. Sleep deprivation, 12 on 3 off, shift changes, no actual shifts until they happened " a day off WAS a day you didn't get called to fly...

I found white collar charters just as bad if not worse. I just can't fall asleep before midnight no matter what I do, and then getting up at 4 or 5 am to go fly to Bonnyville and hold all day. I'd always nap at the hotel, get no exercise cause I felt like poo, get home exhausted, and then get the "well our ops manual says we can dispatch you on a 9 hour turn around" even though it took me half an hour each way to commute so I had to choose between eating showering OR sleeping.

I fell asleep at the wheel driving on McKnight Blvd one morning and hit a curb in rush hour. One "highly reputable" Calgary carrier that everybody loves and no one can say anything bad about without getting pooped on flew me 27 on 3 off 703 white collar flying, but I had the bad attitude when I complained. And no other pilot was willing to say something.

Kinda what you are talking about Widow?

[My-Shoes-Are-Covered]

It's high time we call a spade a spade. SMS is a joke. Operators have just been given carte blanche, and will now for the most part, take full advantage of that. The mags will do for another week. That tire's ok for a bit yet, and yes, you can squeeze your mandatory rest into that period of time.

As described to me by a Transport inspector: When the CAR's are made, the Operators are well represented. Transport Canada is well represented, but there's no one there to represent the pilots, therfor their interests are not considered. I was told that a company can run their 702/703 operation pretty much as they pleased, because Transport doesn't have the resources to police it. The consolation for me is that if I screw up somehow on my duty/rest times then they (TC) "PROBABLY" won't violate me.

If the general public had any concept of the conditions in general that pilots work under in Canada, they would be appalled!

[CD]

Pilots and cabin crew demonstrate over EU duty rules - 05/10/09
Blog - Crew duty hours up for manipulation
Pilots protest over flying hours - 5 October 2009

[Hot Fuel]

I'm curious as too how many on this board actually work within an SMS structure? By the replys it seems that everybody on this sight works for a 705 operation.

bezerker wrote

What happens when an employee files a report that says "myself and other crew members are frequently sleeping while en route despite our best efforts to be properly rested before flight"? Asides from firing the employee when the company figures out who filed the report, SMS will do jack squat to change anything that the employer currently feels is adequate. To continue with my rant here, how anyone in their right mind believes that companies that monitor themselves will add anything whatsoever to safety has been flying on a different planet than I have.

I don't know where you work but at the outfit I work it goes like this.

The scenario you describe would be considered a hazard report, any employee, flight crew or otherwise is obligated to complete and submit a hazard report to the company safety officer. As a side note workplace safety is a bottom up concept not the other way round...if you are expecting other people to make you and your workplace safer you are part of the problem in your workplace.

The hazard report is not anonymous as the employee is protected under the non punitive reporting policies of the SMS program, I suppose they could choice not to put there name to it however I believe the report has less credibility if nobody is willing to stand behind it.

At any rate once the report is received by the safety officer copies are forwarded to the accountable executive and relevant management. i.e DFO, DOM, Chief Pilot, Ground Operations Manager etc. The safety officer tasks the relevant management with performing an investigation of the reported hazard, identifying root cause and contributing factors. In addition to the investigation of the reported hazard they are required to make written recommendations for corrective action, the goal is to reduce the risk of the hazard reoccurring to anyone performing similar tasks.

Copies of the investigation report and any subsequent recommendations produced in the report are forwarded to other members of the safety management team and the accountable executive for review. The report, recommendations and conclusions are also sent to the personnel that filed the report so they stay involved in the process.

The reports are filed and used for trend monitoring by the company safety officer as well as Transport Canada as it is my understanding that TC will simply audit the SMS records instead of the needle in the hay stack method previously used.

The underlying philosophy at work here is quite simple…if you ignore the hazards, don’t report or stand up for safety you will get exactly what you put into your safety program.

Our safety officer probably handles 2 or 3 hazard or incident reports per day and we operate somewhere in the range of 20 aircraft. If you are truly working at being a safety minded company it will reflect in the records that are kept and the documented steps you took to correct or mitigate the perceived risks…the opposite is also true…a lack of records or corrective actions would suggest nothing is happening on the safety front and there is a problem that needs to be dealt with.

[bezerker]

Thanks for the lesson Hot Fuel. Unfortunately you have forgotten your roots and have not been following other SMS discussions on this board. Read closely and you will realize that no one here is bitching about how SMS works for a 705 operator.

705 can be generalized like this: unionized workforce, southern "big city" bases, experienced pilot group, and generally great working conditions. 703/704 is typically a lot different. Two glaring differences. One is the power of the pilot group, as at most 705 operations, the pilot group has voice, at other smaller operations, only the individual has voice. The other difference is the working conditions (especially regarding safety). Every met someone who went to the airlines that wanted to go back to Air Taxi even if the airline pay was less? Me neither. There is not a whole lot to correct regarding safety that will have a large impact on operational costs at most 705 operators.

Your description of your company SMS process is fantastic. I wish all companies were like that. As a side note, workplace safety begins at the top, not the other way around. That is why it probably works at your company. And that is why I feel we need regulation, because some of those at the top are less safety conscious than others. Here is a quote from Advisory Circular (AC) No. 107-001, Guidance on Safety Management Systems Development

"Every organization has a culture, good or bad, safe or unsafe, the corporate culture is reflected in the mode of operation throughout the organisation. Typically, the tone of the culture is established from the top down. If the accountable executive is committed to managing safety risks then the way that organization operates will reflect this philosophy."

Obviously for the last sentence, the opposite will also hold true.

You mention that the employee is protected under the non-punitive reporting program. Who exactly is monitoring this program? Who does the #1 SMS report filler-outer complain to when they get passed over for upgrades, sent to shitty bases, given worse/less trips, laid off due to work shortages, etc? If there has been an ongoing problem for years that management knows about, who the hell is gonna write it up? I gotta pay the rent man, along with everyone else. Maybe that guy who just got hired at WJ and is leaving in February can report it.

You mention all the people that the report is forwarded to at your airline, and who is tasked with investigations and corrective action, and following up. That is great. At some companies however, all those people are one and the same. And they may not be interested in fixing any employee percieved problems.

To rephrase one of your paragraphs: "The underlying philosophy at work here is quite simple…if the accountable executive (owner) ignores the hazards, doesn't report or stand up for safety we will get exactly what they put into the safety program."

You also mention "a lack of records or corrective actions would suggest nothing is happening on the safety front and there is a problem that needs to be dealt with." The question is who is going to deal with this and when? Three years from implementation when TC finally gets its shit together and starts doing SMS audits? Who selects the paperwork that is shown to the auditor? What are the actual penalties for not having enough SMS reports, not doing enough corrective actions, not perceiving risks? Who knows. It will be exactly the same as it is now, except with no TC intervention in the nuts and bolts of the operation.

Before I go, I want to be clear, I am not against SMS. It is a fantastic idea for companies that want to embrace it and I'm sure with some companies it has the potential to reduce risk even while adversely impacting operating costs. Unfortunately packaged with TC's SMS is less operational oversight, which I don't agree with (although I guess it can't get much less than the almost zero oversight we have right now).

My real problem is that almost no companies would chose to enact SMS if it wasn't required by law. That says it all.

[Chuck Ellsworth]

I seem to remember reading somewhere that Keystone hired an ex TC inspector to set up their SMS program which was to be an example for all 703 operators to emulate.

Did that take place before they had that accident in Winnipeg which resulted in the pilot being charged and found guilty of a criminal offense and no one in the company was charged.

Was the pilot the accountable executive at Keystone under their SMS?

[Brown Bear]

I seem to remember reading somewhere that Keystone hired an ex TC inspector to set up their SMS program which was to be an example for all 703 operators to emulate.

Did that take place before they had that accident in Winnipeg which resulted in the pilot being charged and found guilty of a criminal offense and no one in the company was charged.

Was the pilot the accountable executive at Keystone under their SMS?

It was shortly thereafter. Then, like a trained monkey, he hopped up on his soapbox, and claimed Keystone was the safest airline in the country, because HE had initiated an SMS program.....I nearly puked

[Sidebar]

I seem to remember reading somewhere that Keystone hired an ex TC inspector to set up their SMS program which was to be an example for all 703 operators to emulate.

It was shortly thereafter. Then, like a trained monkey, he hopped up on his soapbox, and claimed Keystone was the safest airline in the country, because HE had initiated an SMS program.....I nearly puked

I think Keystone was told by TC to either put an SMS into operation or see their AOC cancelled. Since then, they've been pretty low profile, judging by # of CADORS reports. Could it be their SMS actually improved things?

[Chuck Ellsworth]

I think Keystone was told by TC to either put an SMS into operation or see their AOC cancelled. Since then, they've been pretty low profile, judging by # of CADORS reports.

It took a fatal accident and one of the most high profile court cases in Canadian 703 operations to get TC to take notice...assuming they did.

Could it be their SMS actually improved things?

Or could it be the fear of having another accident and maybe being closed down for good now that they are on the radar scope so to speak?

[mattedfred]

http://www.alpa.org/Portals/Alpa/PressR ... 09.073.htm

[Widow]

I think Keystone was told by TC to either put an SMS into operation or see their AOC cancelled. Since then, they've been pretty low profile, judging by # of CADORS reports. Could it be their SMS actually improved things?

From April:

Word is their SMS has been withdrawn by TC since January 2009. No figure ! The ex TC guy tried to keep the SMS together, but I guess their SMS failed.

viewtopic.php?f=54&t=41032&p=507037#p507037

And various reports on the forum indicate Keystone continued to expect the unacceptable.

Anyway, back on topic - thanks to all who have posted in the thread, and contacted me privately.

Does anyone know if there has been any Canadian research on pilot fatigue?

[b1ngnx33]

I absolutely hate being tired, fatigued, etc.

But here is the HARD COLD reality.

You need money for food and other stuff.

I've worked 14 hour shifts, 12 hours, and other kinds of shifts.

Damn, I hate it.

But I needed cash.

I also hate working 5 days a week, but thats another story.

I can't speak for other people, but I can speak for me.

You just do the damn job.

You just f*****g do it.

I don't care if its aviation, construction, security, blah, blah.

If you cannot afford a lawyer, you have no rights.

Go ahead and try that "legal" crap with the company. You'll be looking for another job.

Companies are not here for the employee. They are here to make money.

Corporations only care about money, not your "tired" ass working for them.

If I could afford a lawyer, I wouldn't need to work.

Make all the laws you want to make.

It doesn't mean a damn thing if cannot afford a lawyer.