Windmilling

bombardierfixer · Post by **bombardierfixer** » Fri May 21, 2010 6:49 pm

So do you let your fans windmill or not? What have you come up with to stop it, aside from tenting the engine?

iflyforpie · Post by **iflyforpie** » Fri May 21, 2010 7:09 pm

Inlet plugs always work good. I was told that windmilling is bad for bearings since there is no oil pressure.

bombardierfixer · Post by **bombardierfixer** » Sat May 22, 2010 1:37 am

Yeah we don't have plugs, or the plastic wading pools.

MZUNGO · Post by **MZUNGO** » Sat May 22, 2010 6:17 am

i remember in my air force days watching the F.E. of a visiting C-5 galaxy jam a 2x4 in the back of the fan to keep it from windmilling.
also i hear seatbelt extensions work quite well
http://www.neptunuslex.com/2008/01/31/a-big-fan/

bombardierfixer · Post by **bombardierfixer** » Sat May 22, 2010 10:40 am

Yeah the 2x4 would be nice altough people watching from the hammerhead may not understand, and then all the calls from TAC and the crew that the engine had ingested somthing

iflyforpie · Post by **iflyforpie** » Sat May 22, 2010 10:56 am

We used zap straps on the C1 fan and IGVs of a JT8D to prevent windmilling on an engine out ferry flight (good thing liveleak didn't get a hold of those photos.

)

You could do the same thing on the ground, just make sure it is really conspicuous. No danger, just delay and embarrassment when the crew try to start and there is no movement on the N1 tach...

palebird · Post by **palebird** » Sat May 22, 2010 1:28 pm

If it is windmilling that means the engine is turning which means the oil pump is turning which means you will have oil pressure of some sort, it is not bad for anything unless the engine is damaged, in which case you tie up the N1 and lock the N2 through the gearbox.

Ballsssssss · Post by **Ballsssssss** » Sat May 22, 2010 1:35 pm

I heard stuffing the inlet full of Canadian Geese works well.

billy ray valintine · Post by **billy ray valintine** » Mon May 24, 2010 2:45 pm

i know i am retired,but i had to chime in on this.
the engines are quite fine windmilling on there own.
are you idiots really serious about this?
if you don't know,then you are part of the problem.
once again,the down fall of aviation is in full swing.
all the talent has gone to other places.
i'm glad the old guy's that i talk to, are elsewhere in the world, making money!
EDIT always be true to Mr. lapointe,or your career is
over ........right?
EDIT!

brv

Pat Richard · Post by **Pat Richard** » Mon May 24, 2010 6:47 pm

palebird wrote:If it is windmilling that means the engine is turning which means the oil pump is turning which means you will have oil pressure of some sort, it is not bad for anything unless the engine is damaged, in which case you tie up the N1 and lock the N2 through the gearbox.

billy ray valintine wrote:i know i am retired,but i had to chime in on this.
the engines are quite fine windmilling on there own.
are you idiots really serious about this?
if you don't know,then you are part of the problem.
once again,the down fall of aviation is in full swing.
all the talent has gone to other places.
i'm glad the old guy's that i talk to, are elsewhere in the world, making money!
EDIT always be true to Mr. lapointe,or your career is
over ........right?
EDIT!

brv

+1

bombardierfixer · Post by **bombardierfixer** » Mon May 24, 2010 9:16 pm

Uhhhh, well thanks for the sage advice...I'm just looking for a quick fix to get management off my back when its blowing, I'm aware that GE feels that a certian amount of windmilling is acceptable, and in the scematic for the CFM 56-7 one of the bearings dosn't get oil wen the engine is windmilling.

Attacking people just puts you into the same catagory as another "engineer" who trolls these boards.

Schimunga · Post by **Schimunga** » Mon May 24, 2010 9:35 pm

BRV--shut up. Nobody needs to hear the ramblings of a bitter old engineer who has nothing better to say then how bad the industry is getting.

c170b53 · Post by **c170b53** » Mon May 24, 2010 9:36 pm

O.K. I'll bite... The oil pump runs off the gearbox which is connected to the N2 spool so its unlikely that that portion of the engine is turning unless your in a very stiff breeze right down the tube. Regardless the shaft bearings sit inside sumps that pool oil, so its unlikely to cause any damage as long as we are talking in day periods. Depending on the manufacturer probably ( could look this up but I'm lazy) after a number of days, you need to perform short term storage and then after that there's long term storage depending on how long the plane will be exposed to the elements.

bombardierfixer · Post by **bombardierfixer** » Mon May 24, 2010 10:03 pm

Its the flavour of the week for us right now. Hopefully next week it will be somthing nice and boring to look at. Just trying to avoid getting beat up by a tent.

ourkid2000 · Post by **ourkid2000** » Thu May 27, 2010 10:41 am

Pat Richard wrote:
palebird wrote:If it is windmilling that means the engine is turning which means the oil pump is turning which means you will have oil pressure of some sort, it is not bad for anything unless the engine is damaged, in which case you tie up the N1 and lock the N2 through the gearbox.

billy ray valintine wrote:i know i am retired,but i had to chime in on this.
the engines are quite fine windmilling on there own.
are you idiots really serious about this?
if you don't know,then you are part of the problem.
once again,the down fall of aviation is in full swing.
all the talent has gone to other places.
i'm glad the old guy's that i talk to, are elsewhere in the world, making money!
EDIT always be true to Mr. lapointe,or your career is
over ........right?
EDIT!

brv
+1

This place is insane......I just don't understand.

Instead of ripping these people a new one, why don't you politely explain your reasons. Not everyone here has had the training and experience that some others have had.

A great chance to learn some valuable information has turned into a pissing match of "I know more than you" crap.

Hedley · Post by **Hedley** » Thu May 27, 2010 12:46 pm

I'm just a dumb pilot, I put the plugs in the intake to stop them from windmilling.

Maybe I don't really need to, but I'm not going to stop doing it anytime soon because I just don't know the internals of that turbine very well.

c170b53 · Post by **c170b53** » Thu May 27, 2010 9:59 pm

Stating the specific engine would help those pondering the answer. If known someone here could probably tell you which sumps contained the rollers and which sumps contained both thrust bearings and rollers, plus lots of other boring stuff. There's way too much to know and by the time you do know it inside and out its old technology.
If some are bitter I understand completely but really there are no stupid questions especially if something is gumming up your brain and all you're coming up with is NCD.

bombardierfixer · Post by **bombardierfixer** » Thu May 27, 2010 11:20 pm

CFM56-7 737NG engines.

Heliian · Post by **Heliian** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 3:45 am

WOW. what an a-hole. and BTW brv, over the last decades, we have learned how to prolong the life an engine by taking the proper measures ie. inlet plugs and storage procedures. We would like to learn from your generation not only your infinite knowledge but also from your MISTAKES. There is no such thing as a stupid question. Good luck to all.

See you in the lounge!

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