Jerry cans: legal and safe ?

[digits_]

Hello everybody,

I am planning to make a trip through the northern part of Canada in a C172. Since the AVGAS fuel is very rare or incredibly expensive, I am contemplating the idea of bringing a bunch of jerry cans with extra fuel. However, I would like to know if this is safe and legal to do.

It will be a N-registered USA airplane, an FAA license. I will only use the jerry cans in Canadian airspace.

Thank you very much for any advice !

Kind regards,
digits

[LousyFisherman]

If you are flying privately it is legal. The citation is in the TDG section of Transport Canada.

I believe it is safe, but others don't.

YMMV
LF

[Northern Flyer]

Hello everybody,

I am planning to make a trip through the northern part of Canada in a C172. Since the AVGAS fuel is very rare or incredibly expensive, I am contemplating the idea of bringing a bunch of jerry cans with extra fuel. However, I would like to know if this is safe and legal to do.

It will be a N-registered USA airplane, an FAA license. I will only use the jerry cans in Canadian airspace.

Thank you very much for any advice !

Kind regards,
digits

Not a problem my friend, and its safe as long as the caps don't leak, and you refrain from smoking. The only thing about jerry cans and avgas is that the plastic can build up a static charge especially in the winter so be careful refueling.

Just out of curiosity what is northern Canada to you? Where are you planning your trip?

[digits_]

Hello everybody,

I am planning to make a trip through the northern part of Canada in a C172. Since the AVGAS fuel is very rare or incredibly expensive, I am contemplating the idea of bringing a bunch of jerry cans with extra fuel. However, I would like to know if this is safe and legal to do.

It will be a N-registered USA airplane, an FAA license. I will only use the jerry cans in Canadian airspace.

Thank you very much for any advice !

Kind regards,
digits

Not a problem my friend, and its safe as long as the caps don't leak, and you refrain from smoking. The only thing about jerry cans and avgas is that the plastic can build up a static charge especially in the winter so be careful refueling.

Just out of curiosity what is northern Canada to you? Where are you planning your trip?

Eureka (Nunavut) would be the most northern airfield on my wishlist. I might have some other questions about the route, but I'll start a new topic for that once my plans are coming together a bit more, just needed to figure this part out first, otherwist the game was already over

Do I need to let the remaining (very little) air escape from the jerry cans due to the pressure difference, or is that not a problem either ? I don't smoke, so that won't be a problem.
Won't the static electricity be a problem inside the airplane either ? For example when 2 jerrycans would be moving against each other, couldn't that give sparks ?

Thanks !

[Rudder Bug]

I've travelled a lot with jerry cans and I don't see any issues if they are properly secured and tightly closed. Avoid filling them up to the neck, make some room for the expansion.

However, we had two fuel/static related accidents, just in my neighborhood this year. A good friend of mine got severely burned when his C-180 cought fire in his hangar as he threw some Avgas in with a jerry can. In the other case, a whole hangar containing several aircraft burned, along with its containt.

Now, just imagine walking across a tarmac with a nylon can rubbing against your nylon garments; it will build up a tremendous amount of static that might require several minutes to discharge, before the "Bick Lighter Effect" dissipates.

More and more people ground their jerry can to the aircraft and to themselves. We learn every day don't we?

When I refuel my aircraft with a jerry can, I drop it on the wing and let it sit for a while, say the time of the walkaround. Then I make sure I am touching both the wing surface and the can before I pour it in, and even though, I am prepared for the worst, but so far nothing has happened...yet!

My local airfield is CYFJ and they have customs. You are more than welcome for an overnight in my place if it is along your route. And I will gladly give you an in depth briefing for your trip up north.

Fly safe

RB

[Northern Flyer]

That sounds like it will be one hell of a trip. I have to agree that finding avgas will be a real challenge. Best of luck.

[Sky Pilot]

I've carried a lot of jerry cans over the years, and never had a problem. One crazy old lodge owner showed up at my dock with 18 jerry cans full of avgas in his C180. I docked him as he opened the door and took a long drag on his "Captain Black". Doh!

[Rudder Bug]

Digits;

Have you got a Mogas STC?

If so it will really payoff since just in Kuujjuaq, $800 buys you a 45 gal drum of 100LL. That's 15 bucks a gallon instead of $5.75 if you use mogas.

Gilles

[digits_]

I do not have a mogas STC. The avgas is a challenge indeed. In Eureka prices are 1500$ for the same drum

Is it only the fuel that is so expensive up north, or are places to stay and food also extremely expensive ?

Rudder bug: you've got a pm!

[buck82]

Remember, the fuel itself can build up a charge or potential difference from the airframe... especially when you are carrying it in plastic jerry cans which act as an insulator. To safely ground the fuel inside the jerry cans before you begin transfering fuel, you should consider trailing a length of wire/cable from the fuel itself and then allow the other end to touch a dry clean piece of the airframe away from a vapour source. This way if there is enough of a potential difference between your fuel and the airframe, the discharge and resulting spark will occur away from the fuel and its vapours. This is especially critical in cold weather, and I know of one case where the fuel was not grounded and it caused a signifigant explosion and fire.

[Sky Pilot]

I do not have a mogas STC. The avgas is a challenge indeed. In Eureka prices are 1500$ for the same drum

Is it only the fuel that is so expensive up north, or are places to stay and food also extremely expensive ?

Rudder bug: you've got a pm!

If you plan on a stop in Baker Lake, the hotel is expensive, bring your own food, and get off the pot before flushing!!

[stef]

Mind me asking what sort of experience you have?

I'm sure you've considered this, but northern Canada strikes me as quite a dangerous place for anyone but an experienced pilot in an appropriate machine.

[Jungle Jim]

Guys,

The static charge builds up on the surface of the liquid not the outside of the container. This is why approved fuel funnels have graphite molded into them. It ensures a ground path from the fuel to the plane tank filler neck and as the fuel swirls around the funnel it does not pick up any additional charge. I see our local sky diving guys with wire cables on the outside of the can, which does nothing to dispate a charge. Best to place the can on the ground a ways from the plane, Drop a bare wire into the fuel through the vent hole in the jerry can and then use the other end to ground to the plane. Then leave the wire in place and pour the gas. Better yet would be to use a jerry can that is electrically conductive.

Jim

[Northern Flyer]

I do not have a mogas STC. The avgas is a challenge indeed. In Eureka prices are 1500$ for the same drum

Is it only the fuel that is so expensive up north, or are places to stay and food also extremely expensive ?

Rudder bug: you've got a pm!

Yes, everything is extremely expensive. Haul the majority of your own food, and you don't want to stay in the "hotels" The Inn's North in Arviat for example was well over $200 a night six years ago.

[digits_]

Mind me asking what sort of experience you have?

I'm sure you've considered this, but northern Canada strikes me as quite a dangerous place for anyone but an experienced pilot in an appropriate machine.

Compared to all of you, probably "almost none". At the moment of my trip I'll have a JAR CPL + IR (perhaps + ME), 275 TT and an FAA PPL (+ IR if required). I've flown across europe (ireland - romania), but no experience in usa or canada. But you have to start someday, right ?

Anyway, I've heard both "you're an idiot" and "so nice!" responses many times now, so yes, I've considered it and I'm willing to take the chance. But not without proper information and looking up and reading anything there is to read. Hence this message on your helpfull forum.

Kind regards !
Digits

[zed]

Here's a few things I found/understand regarding at least safety, if not legality.

From Scepter.com
Plastic is an insulator while steel is a conductor which means it is more difficult for a plastic can to shed or redirect the static charge.
To minimise static accumulation on a plastic jerry can, the user should ensure the can is sitting on the ground when being filled and not leave them in a vehicle bracket or sitting in the back of a vehicle when doing so. Furthermore, with the can sitting on the ground, wiping the exterior with a cotton rag wetted with water will remove the majority of any static charge that has accumulated.

Before refuelling an aircraft from a plastic container the person, as a additional precaution, may also endeavor to discharge any static charge that may have accumulated on the aircraft. This can be done by means of placing a charge-conducting material between the aircraft and the ground.

In addition to the idea of a wet rag, which in our climate can be a bit difficult, it might be possible to use anti-static wipes or fabric softer sheets to wipe the plastic jerry can prior to use. Not a hundred percent, but it should I think remove a good deal of the static charge, but someone else may know more about doing something like that. Probably, faster then just leaving it on the ground waiting for the charge to eventually dissipate. Because the plastic can is largely non-conductive, and the static charge is formed over the surface rather then built up in the casing material.
You might think metal cans would be better, but they are only better if you ground them. An ungrounded can would actually be worse then the plastic can. However, they would likely dissipate a charge faster sitting on the ground then the plastic one.

Here's an article that discusses the subject as well.

Fuel Handling Safety.pdf

(251.1 KiB) Downloaded 363 times

[digits_]

Very useful article indeed !

The trip will be around july, the temperatures will probably be of a more civilised nature

[sheephunter]

July weather can get extremely warm so expect conductive weather patterns mid-day and mosquitoes and black-flies among other things until you get to the far north. I would seriously consider the Mogas STC. Every camp you pass will have it. Not necessarily for sale but maybe enough to get you out of a jam and like rudderbug says, it's a lot cheaper and more available. How far east are you planning? I won't be at my little camp in the Ungava area until late Aug. but you're more than welcome to visit and weather a storm if you need. You're going to see a lot of country that most Canadians never will. Have fun.

[sheephunter]

Just dawned on me that you might be on wheels? If so, I'd reconsider and get on floats. Where are you departing from in the US and why start in the US if your goal is Eureka? Not a problem, just curious.

[Rudder Bug]

Nice advice Sheephunter. We were in the same area last fall. I was flying PDU with Sammy.

And yup, those mosquitoes and black flies are something Digits won't believe until he sees. Some are so big they can get the crabs!

RB

[digits_]

Just dawned on me that you might be on wheels? If so, I'd reconsider and get on floats. Where are you departing from in the US and why start in the US if your goal is Eureka? Not a problem, just curious.

I will be on wheels indeed. Different reasons for that: I've never flown a float plane, and the rental rates are much higher than an old (but well-maintained ) C172.
Why US: good question actually. Mainly because that's how the idea started, and I also want to build some extra hours. Never been to the US as well, so on my way back I'll do the tourist stuff.

About the mosquito's: I've been to Kiruna (as a passenger) in sweden during summer, so I already have a very small idea of what to expect - i hope hehe.

[digits_]

What would be a mogas STC: how much would it cost and is it reversible (as in: removable without permanent airplane damage) ?

I would basically fly from Florida in a straight line to Eureka, probably via Churchill for fuel. So not extremely east. Would this make a big difference for the weather etc ?

[Rudder Bug]

Just dawned on me that you might be on wheels? If so, I'd reconsider and get on floats. Where are you departing from in the US and why start in the US if your goal is Eureka? Not a problem, just curious.

Personally, I would rather do it on wheels to maximize the range, considering there are many unpublished airstrips that can be used for emergency or WX.

RB

[digits_]

Just dawned on me that you might be on wheels? If so, I'd reconsider and get on floats. Where are you departing from in the US and why start in the US if your goal is Eureka? Not a problem, just curious.

Personally, I would rather do it on wheels to maximize the range, considering there are many unpublished airstrips that can be used for emergency or WX.

RB

Is there some sort of unofficial list/book with unpublished airstrips ?
I looked into AC-U-KWIK, but they don't find any of those small airfields. Even Eureka wasn't in it

[Rudder Bug]

Digits,

Many of the fishing/hunting camps have an airstrip but most of them are short and rough, basically made for a Twin Otter or anything with big wheels and STOL capabilities.

The local pilots you'll meet down the road will provide you with the best information about those unknown places.

Though I don't know much about Eureka, I can provide you with some leads about flying the Ungava and northern Quebec.

Someone else with the experience should eventually chime in and tell us about Eureka, and that's the beauty of this forum!