WestJet Regional - WestJet Encore

[amraam]

WestJet has announced the name of their new Regional Airline:

WestJet Encore:

http://westjet2.mediaroom.com/index.php?s=43&item=708

amraam

[jazzbeat]

Westjet Encore.... did you guys hire AC's marketing guy who created Zip, Tango and Jazz...

[Flap_Operator]

Westjet Encore.... did you guys hire AC's marketing guy who created Zip, Tango and Jazz...

Hope not lolll

Best of luck to Westjet with this encore regional airline

[jazzbeat]

Sure it will be a success... Now if we could also trade Westjet's with Ac's management I'm pretty sure we could also be a great airline...

If I was a young gun today I would rather wear teal than red

[AirMail]

yeah I wonder what the other choices were that could've been voted. Like the above mentioned, sounds like a take on the failed AC music theme. None the less I know the WS regional will be a success

[ant_321]

Any news on their payscale yet? I heard rumors that it isn't real impressive.

[Flap_Operator]

Any news on their payscale yet? I heard rumors that it isn't real impressive.

It cant be they have to compete with SR ... But again its a start up, cant have the pay start at year ten! Im sure the scale will be somewhat reasonable...

[goleafsgo]

Does anyone know if the westjet encore guys will be able to move up to the 737 or is it going to be treated as 2 separate companies and they'd have to reapply to westjet mainline to fly the '37?

[mbav8r]

Edited; sounds like it could have been wrong info and don't want to spread false info...
I also took some sample salaries from comparable equipment and came up with 80% of median, about 56,000.00, I hope I'm wrong!

[Go Guns]

Does anyone know if the westjet encore guys will be able to move up to the 737 or is it going to be treated as 2 separate companies and they'd have to reapply to westjet mainline to fly the '37?

No need to reapply, go from Dash 8 to 737 as soon as your number is up and there's a spot. There might be more to it, like having to put a minimum time in on the Dash.

[Gear Up]

Personnaly, Encore doesn't sound right. I don't have a better idea off the top of my head but I'm hearing the vote was only obtained from a select few from within our ranks. Regardless of what those "ranks" voted for, the marketing people made the decision to go with what they thought would be best. I think the whole vote thingy was smoke and mirrors just to give us the impression that we had a say/vote. We're maturing as an airline and I see some serious challenges coming our way. Bringing in outsiders as top level management is a problem just for starters. They might say they understand our culture but they don't have it embedded in themselves like some of us who have been around for a long time. Sorry to have a slightly negative tone but I'm not seeing WS any different then any other airline as we move forward. I hope I'm wrong but just look at some of the management departures lately....DT... VP Airports, PM...YYZ GM, MB, Dir Airports...and probably more I haven't heard about. And then, there's the thingy of bringing in outsiders at senior management level......starting at the top! We already went through that with SD and this whole Sabre situation and now........? And then we're reducing seat pitch in the back to be in line with industty standard? I thought we didn;t want to be "industry standard hence my comment about becoming no diffferent then any other airline.
End of rant.....flame away folks!
GU

[jjj]

Gear up,

Encore resounds as well as Jazz did about a decade ago. Nobody complains about the name Jazz because the branding was a success.

Sorry to burst your bubble but the worst fiascos at WS were caused by original WS management; remember the corporate espionage that cost us 20 million and then there was the idea of designing our own reservation which cost another 30 million. Among other issues, that's 50 million reasons why we parachute in management at the top.

The stock is in the high 17s and it has been a long grind to get back to that. The business decisions about seat pitch etc. are driven by the same guy that has brought us millions in revenue through code-shares and other cost saving/generating initiatives.

Culture is important but this is a business first. All the cool-aid in China won't be enough when we stop making money.

The culture helps drive the business and the cash helps drive the culture. When the cash dries up then you will have cause to worry about culture.

Profit share is next month and you don't have to worry about how to pay for Christmas again this year.

Cheers mate and stay focused - 2013 is a contract year for pilots.

JJJ

[Darkwing Duck]

Gear up,

Cheers mate and stay focused - 2013 is a contract year for pilots.

JJJ

And this is the mentality I hate. So much for a team player. You think any airline is run on pilots alone. What about the CSRs, the AMEs, SOC and Dispatch, not to forget about the FA's, ramp personnel or the other half dozen or so positions it takes to run an airline this size. I would love to see you get out of the pointy end of the Dash after you have done a 50hr inspection, shuffle over to the ticket counter, start checking people in, dash back out, groom the Dash, arrange all the pretzels and Bits and Bites, run around to the back and start loading in the bags, run back in and file your plan, run back out and refuel the plane because you now know your payload and route. I could go on, but you know the rest (I hope). And then you would whine and cry and blubber like most pilots do. Frick dude, pull your head out of your arse.

[The_Jesus]

And this is the mentality I hate. So much for a team player. You think any airline is run on pilots alone. What about the CSRs, the AMEs, SOC and Dispatch, not to forget about the FA's, ramp personnel or the other half dozen or so positions it takes to run an airline this size. I would love to see you get out of the pointy end of the Dash after you have done a 50hr inspection, shuffle over to the ticket counter, start checking people in, dash back out, groom the Dash, arrange all the pretzels and Bits and Bites, run around to the back and start loading in the bags, run back in and file your plan, run back out and refuel the plane because you now know your payload and route. I could go on, but you know the rest (I hope). And then you would whine and cry and blubber like most pilots do. Frick dude, pull your head out of your arse.

Hey not sure if you are just trolling here or you're just ignorant. Pretty much all the pilots that have been lucky enough to reach this level have worked in each one of those positions you mentioned during their career.

You must not be a pilot or else you would have already experienced loading your own bags then deicing (with a backpack sprayer and broom while the snow is dumping) in the middle of winter. Yes believe it or not this moron pilot has checked in people for a flight. I have done minor repairs in an airplane when the maintenance guy in his cozy office on the other end of the phone asks me if I brought my toolbox. Why the F^8K would I carry a toolbox with me? Believe it or not I have also gone in the back and served drinks or food to Passengers too. Yup I even know how to file my own flight plan and put that stuff in the tanks that makes us go. Whats that called again..... I can even count cargo and people and add them up without a calculator if you can believe it.

Even now every one of the guys here still has the drive to make this company succeed and will go help out guests or whatever needs to be done. Not saying the company would run without all those other critical parts, but as a team we make it successful.

Congratulations you made me waste 10 min of my life.

[True North]

And this is the mentality I hate. So much for a team player. You think any airline is run on pilots alone. What about the CSRs, the AMEs, SOC and Dispatch, not to forget about the FA's, ramp personnel or the other half dozen or so positions it takes to run an airline this size. I would love to see you get out of the pointy end of the Dash after you have done a 50hr inspection, shuffle over to the ticket counter, start checking people in, dash back out, groom the Dash, arrange all the pretzels and Bits and Bites, run around to the back and start loading in the bags, run back in and file your plan, run back out and refuel the plane because you now know your payload and route. I could go on, but you know the rest (I hope). And then you would whine and cry and blubber like most pilots do. Frick dude, pull your head out of your arse.

What does any of that drivel have to do with the pilots going into a contract year?

[7thirtyseven]

And this is the mentality I hate. So much for a team player. You think any airline is run on pilots alone. What about the CSRs, the AMEs, SOC and Dispatch, not to forget about the FA's, ramp personnel or the other half dozen or so positions it takes to run an airline this size. I would love to see you get out of the pointy end of the Dash after you have done a 50hr inspection, shuffle over to the ticket counter, start checking people in, dash back out, groom the Dash, arrange all the pretzels and Bits and Bites, run around to the back and start loading in the bags, run back in and file your plan, run back out and refuel the plane because you now know your payload and route. I could go on, but you know the rest (I hope). And then you would whine and cry and blubber like most pilots do. Frick dude, pull your head out of your arse.

What does any of that drivel have to do with the pilots going into a contract year?

Contract years and drivel go hand in hand. Thus has been my humble experience. However advice to pull "your head out of your arse" is probably a gem to remember, I personally have filed it right below the "golden rule".

[Darkwing Duck]

And this is the mentality I hate. So much for a team player. You think any airline is run on pilots alone. What about the CSRs, the AMEs, SOC and Dispatch, not to forget about the FA's, ramp personnel or the other half dozen or so positions it takes to run an airline this size. I would love to see you get out of the pointy end of the Dash after you have done a 50hr inspection, shuffle over to the ticket counter, start checking people in, dash back out, groom the Dash, arrange all the pretzels and Bits and Bites, run around to the back and start loading in the bags, run back in and file your plan, run back out and refuel the plane because you now know your payload and route. I could go on, but you know the rest (I hope). And then you would whine and cry and blubber like most pilots do. Frick dude, pull your head out of your arse.

Hey not sure if you are just trolling here or you're just ignorant. Pretty much all the pilots that have been lucky enough to reach this level have worked in each one of those positions you mentioned during their career.

You must not be a pilot or else you would have already experienced loading your own bags then deicing (with a backpack sprayer and broom while the snow is dumping) in the middle of winter. Yes believe it or not this moron pilot has checked in people for a flight. I have done minor repairs in an airplane when the maintenance guy in his cozy office on the other end of the phone asks me if I brought my toolbox. Why the F^8K would I carry a toolbox with me? Believe it or not I have also gone in the back and served drinks or food to Passengers too. Yup I even know how to file my own flight plan and put that stuff in the tanks that makes us go. Whats that called again..... I can even count cargo and people and add them up without a calculator if you can believe it.

Even now every one of the guys here still has the drive to make this company succeed and will go help out guests or whatever needs to be done. Not saying the company would run without all those other critical parts, but as a team we make it successful.

Congratulations you made me waste 10 min of my life.

Well, "The Jesus" (Mighty big handle there big guy, but i bet you still can't fill the "real" Jesus' boots), as a matter of fact I am a pilot. Done all that and then some as well. What I was getting at was that JJJ was stating that it is a contract year for pilots. Now I could be wrong but it seemed to me his point was that only pilots will benefit from Team Teal Jr. starting up. However, unlike you, I realize that it takes a hell of a lot more peeps to get an aircraft off the ground besides the guy with the gold bars on his shoulders. Proud of you though being able to go through all the motions you just mentioned. Seems like you are living up to your handle very well and the only one who has ever done this. And sorry about your ten minutes of life you lost. No one twisted your arm to respond.

[vrrotate]

Team teal wears silver bars.

[7thirtyseven]

Well, "The Jesus" (Mighty big handle there big guy, but i bet you still can't fill the "real" Jesus' boots), as a matter of fact I am a pilot. Done all that and then some as well. What I was getting at was that JJJ was stating that it is a contract year for pilots. Now I could be wrong but it seemed to me his point was that only pilots will benefit from Team Teal Jr. starting up. However, unlike you, I realize that it takes a hell of a lot more peeps to get an aircraft off the ground besides the guy with the gold bars on his shoulders. Proud of you though being able to go through all the motions you just mentioned. Seems like you are living up to your handle very well and the only one who has ever done this. And sorry about your ten minutes of life you lost. No one twisted your arm to respond.

I'm gonna go with the bold on this one. You may want to reread jjj's post.

[Leerboy]

Hey Darkwing.
I hear it is a contract year for lunch ladies at your flying college. Take a bit of time and consider that it means as much to a guy working day to day at an airline as it does any of the other of the many contract negotiations out there. I think you may want to take a break from posting. If everyone comes to JJJ's aid then you know you are in the wrong.

[Realitychex]

Gear up,

Encore resounds as well as Jazz did about a decade ago. Nobody complains about the name Jazz because the branding was a success.

Sorry to burst your bubble but the worst fiascos at WS were caused by original WS management; remember the corporate espionage that cost us 20 million and then there was the idea of designing our own reservation which cost another 30 million. Among other issues, that's 50 million reasons why we parachute in management at the top.

The stock is in the high 17s and it has been a long grind to get back to that. The business decisions about seat pitch etc. are driven by the same guy that has brought us millions in revenue through code-shares and other cost saving/generating initiatives.

Culture is important but this is a business first. All the cool-aid in China won't be enough when we stop making money.

The culture helps drive the business and the cash helps drive the culture. When the cash dries up then you will have cause to worry about culture.

Profit share is next month and you don't have to worry about how to pay for Christmas again this year.

Cheers mate and stay focused - 2013 is a contract year for pilots.

JJJ

You wouldn't have a job today at one of the most stable airlines on the planet were it not for the particular talents of the original executive team.

There are a number of professional airline managers that might be familiar to you that declined the opportunity to join WJ in the very early days when all the heavy lifting was done.

As the company has grown / matured, the entrepreneurial people have moved on and been replaced by professional managers that tend to be risk adverse. They tend to know what they know. That's normal evolution. The key is to figure out when to make the cutover as entrepreneurial types tend to be sprinters, not long distance runners.

Encore has been designed by professional aviation managers and consultants, not entrepreneurial airline people.

This is interesting given that it is easy to make the case that the successful start-ups world wide over the past 20 years or more have been led by entrepreneurial types, not professional aviation managers. All the airline with-in an airline attempts, no matter how they were constituted on paper, have failed, and all of them were run by professional airline managers.

It'll be interesting to watch how it all unfolds.

[Huge Hammer]

I think Realitychex has hit it on the head.

Another thing to keep in mind is that a lot of those fresh eyed WestJetters full of piss and vinegar are now front line and middle managers with kids and a mortgage and are probably more risk adverse as well.

Durfy was more of an entrepreneur than the current leadership.

I do not know which way is the better path as the type of people who start things are not always the best to maintain them. Guys like Neelman, Bell, etc are at their best when they are creating the latest shiny toy, not doing day to day managing of the routine.

On a side note laying "the fiascos of the past" on anyones feet is wrong headed. WS succeeded with those guys as well as having the set backs. You can't have one without the other.

[True North]

I think Realitychex has hit it on the head.

Another thing to keep in mind is that a lot of those fresh eyed WestJetters full of piss and vinegar are now front line and middle managers with kids and a mortgage and are probably more risk adverse as well.

Durfy was more of an entrepreneur than the current leadership.

I do not know which way is the better path as the type of people who start things are not always the best to maintain them. Guys like Neelman, Bell, etc are at their best when they are creating the latest shiny toy, not doing day to day managing of the routine.

On a side note laying "the fiascos of the past" on anyones feet is wrong headed. WS succeeded with those guys as well as having the set backs. You can't have one without the other.

I don't know much about Sean Durfy, never met the man but my buddies at WJ tell me he was very personable and approachable. What I do know is that he was at the helm for the switchover to Sabre, which was an unmitigated disaster. I think WJ has only recently fully recovered from the fallout, the loss of customer satisfaction, but they will never recover the lost millions of $. My guess is that hastened his departure.

[jjj]

Darkwing,

My post was a response to Gear Up's concern about the state of the union - that's all. The comment about 2013 being a contract year is a reminder that we must keep focus on the major issues.

Reality,

No doubt I have the job I do because a founding few decided to do things a bit different and it paid off. WS is a company that grew beyond the wildest dreams and abilities of the founding few and that is where some grave mistakes were made. Fortunately, their successes outweigh their pitfalls and I am greatful for that.

Cheers mates.

Leerboy - you funny.

JJJ

[Huge Hammer]

@True North - The Sabre cutoover had problems but to call it an unmitigated disaster just is not accurate. I am not so sure about your figure on last revenue because of it, do you have a source for the "millions lost"?