Cessna - Glider Midair Collision near Pemberton

[boeingboy]

News 1130 reporting CFB comox confirms 2 dead in a glider/cessna mid air. Witnesses reported seing 2 white wings slowly fluttering to the ground.

http://www.news1130.com/2013/06/29/fata ... pemberton/

[Shiny Side Up]

They're saying four fatal now.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-c ... plane.html

[Rookie50]

My condolences. Midairs are awful.

[North Shore]

Oh, No...

[ahramin]

Terrible news.

If anyone has information on whose glider please pm me.

[MikeGolfEcho]

Any further news? My sincere condolences to all affected

[bizjets101]

TSB reports a Cessna and a Powered Glider, victims 4 persons and 1 dog.
Some brutal details regarding the collision - should be more info in 6pm Vancouver news.

Note' Pemberton Soaring Centre just added a Stemme SV10VT

Pemberton Soaring Centre website

[pelmet]

Certainly a tragedy.

I didn't know they had a Stemme. I went to their factory east of Berlin a few years ago. Pretty interesting machine. Maybe it is normal in the glider world, but I thought it was interesting how they have solar panels to charge the battery. Most of the aircraft is composite but there is a metal cage structure around the central fuselage area.

[bizjets101]

Powered Gliders at Pemberton BC

There is a single seat Glaser-Dirks DG-400, and a Pipistrel Taurus two seat -
both powered gliders, along with the Stemme SV-10VT.

Press report police have stated the Cessna was based at 100 Mile Airport.

[AirFrame]

There are only two 150's registered to owners in 100 mile house, one to a forest products company and the other to a private owner.

This is the first time in quite a while that I can remember, where the news photos of the wreckage don't happen to show the registration letters of either aircraft.

[RatherBeFlying]

Most gliders these days have flight loggers; so, TSB will likely be able to determine the flight path of the glider.

I don't know if the Pemberton gliders are equipped with PowerFlarms, which also warn against Mode C and S equipped aircraft. But if the 150 was not operating a transponder, a PowerFlarm would not issue any warning.

Yesterday we were testing our PowerFlarms which detected a Mode C 1200' above our field within 2 miles.

[iflyforpie]

Don't FLARMs require a SSR interrogation of the transponder in order to work? Lots of radar blind spots in BC, and it is foolish to rely solely on those for traffic avoidance.

[pez]

I am sorry to hear this terrible news. I did a tow checkout on Rudy's Citabria 3 years ago and flew gliders and tow planes in BC for 3 summers for a different operator. Followed the news of the Stemme on it's acquisition last year, then heard this news today. Terrible thing to hear.

Condolences to the families of all involved.


-Colin

[RatherBeFlying]

Correct: The PowerFlarm does not interrogate transponders; it only picks up replies.

Agreed it's only a supplement to lookout, but just about every pilot who's spent time with one finds there's a whole bunch more aircraft out there than s/he's been seeing.

[Colonel Sanders]

there's a whole bunch more aircraft out there than s/he's been seeing

That's because they aren't paying enough attention
to LOOKING OUTSIDE - they're probably playing with
the toys in the panel. Frankly, I don't know why many
of them even went flying. Why not save the money
and just play with Msoft FlightSim, if all you care about
is what's in the panel?

You wouldn't believe the percentage of pilots that I
fly with, that have severely deficient lookout skills. I
ask them to turn left, they do so without looking
first. Ouch.

Forget the electronic toys which sucker you in and
fill you with a false sense of confidence. If you hit
an aircraft without a VHF comm or mode C, it's
going to hurt just as much

Only two things keep you from a mid-air:

1) paranoia
2) eyeballs

Your paranoia should crank up when you are someplace
with an unnatural concentration of aircraft (final, VOR,
etc).

And do try LOOKING OUTSIDE more. I doubt that
there is a single person reading this, that couldn't
improve their visual scanning skills.

Final thought, sure to upset people: You may have all
sorts of aircraft buzzing about. But you can only hit
the ones that are at the same altitude as you. I have
to laugh when I hear aircraft at say 9500 feet calling
UNICOM, telling them that they are flying overhead
the airport, 1.5 miles vertically above.

You would be amazed at how many pilots don't think
in 3 dimensions. They don't use the vertical - they
drive an airplane around like a car. To resolve a conflict,
I change altitude. Radical thought, I know. I don't mind
in the least pitching up, gaining 1000 feet, rolling upside
down and looking down at the traffic beneath me.

[Indanao]

I am sorry to hear this terrible news. I did a tow checkout on Rudy's Citabria 3 years ago and flew gliders and tow planes in BC for 3 summers for a different operator. Followed the news of the Stemme on it's acquisition last year, then heard this news today. Terrible thing to hear.

Condolences to the families of all involved.


-Colin

+1 Great guy.

[2R]

Does anyone have a current VNC for the area ?
I cannot find a CYA for aerobatics in that valley on my old copy.

[CFR]

there's a whole bunch more aircraft out there than s/he's been seeing

That's because they aren't paying enough attention
to LOOKING OUTSIDE - they're probably playing with
the toys in the panel. Frankly, I don't know why many
of them even went flying. Why not save the money
and just play with Msoft FlightSim, if all you care about
is what's in the panel?

You wouldn't believe the percentage of pilots that I
fly with, that have severely deficient lookout skills. I
ask them to turn left, they do so without looking
first. Ouch.

Forget the electronic toys which sucker you in and
fill you with a false sense of confidence. If you hit
an aircraft without a VHF comm or mode C, it's
going to hurt just as much

Only two things keep you from a mid-air:

1) paranoia
2) eyeballs

Your paranoia should crank up when you are someplace
with an unnatural concentration of aircraft (final, VOR,
etc).

And do try LOOKING OUTSIDE more. I doubt that
there is a single person reading this, that couldn't
improve their visual scanning skills.

Final thought, sure to upset people: You may have all
sorts of aircraft buzzing about. But you can only hit
the ones that are at the same altitude as you. I have
to laugh when I hear aircraft at say 9500 feet calling
UNICOM, telling them that they are flying overhead
the airport, 1.5 miles vertically above.

You would be amazed at how many pilots don't think
in 3 dimensions. They don't use the vertical - they
drive an airplane around like a car. To resolve a conflict,
I change altitude. Radical thought, I know. I don't mind
in the least pitching up, gaining 1000 feet, rolling upside
down and looking down at the traffic beneath me.

Why you look out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6GRUp_3nZo

[AirFrame]

Does anyone have a current VNC for the area ?
I cannot find a CYA for aerobatics in that valley on my old copy.

I believe CYA116 is the glider area... Just northwest of the airport. I can't tell where Nairn Falls is relative to that... I'm not that familiar with the airspace up there... Only been to Pemberton once!

[AirFrame]

You would be amazed at how many pilots don't think
in 3 dimensions. They don't use the vertical - they
drive an airplane around like a car. To resolve a conflict,
I change altitude. Radical thought, I know. I don't mind
in the least pitching up, gaining 1000 feet, rolling upside
down and looking down at the traffic beneath me.

Two things come to mind reading this... First, I've done exactly what you described... Imminent head on with a floatplane, so I pitched up 30degrees, gained 500', then started a roll... As my wing dropped out of view vertically I picked up the floatplane, which passed under me as I rolled inverted. The floatplane never budged from its route.

Second, it's worth pointing out that if a collision seems likely, that vertical excursions (push or pull) are a quicker way out than turns. Assuming you both start straight and level, of course. Two parallel wings can pass each other with about 5-10' of separation, in most cases. Two wings at 90degrees to one another have to clear the full wingspan of the other plane.

[Sidebar]

...it's worth pointing out that if a collision seems likely, that vertical excursions (push or pull) are a quicker way out than turns.

This is how TCAS works; it provides commands to provide vertical separation.

[F-16]

I still can't believe the news about the unfortunate accident in Pemberton.

The Pemberton Soaring Center helped many people get their start in aviation - towing gliders for the season, getting glider licenses, doing glider rides, etc. and this was true for me.

I haven't been up there in a number of years, but my heart goes out to R.R.'s family.

He was a great person to work for, and this was a real shock.

[crazy_aviator]

Im just as at fault as anyone else, especially in my younger years ( reading an aviation mag while flying up north !!) Nowadays, the big sky theory just doesnt cut it with me. The owner of the C-150 , I believe, met me the day before to look at my airplane, brings it close to home. On another thread, IF you confirm an aircraft that is passing you DONT fixate, that A/C wont hurt you ,,, its the one your not looking for thats gonna kill ya, so confirm, resolve, THEN continue to look for more Another thing, NEVER speak frivolously near an airport,,leave the frequency open for position reports, switch to air to air if you want to gossip

[rsandor]

I too flew with Rudy, and remember him well. I liked his straight-to-the-point attitude. I regret not spending more time up there. He will be missed.

[lownslow]

What a terrible thing to hear about. In my mind a mid-air is about the second scariest thing that can happen in an airplane (right behind in-flight fire for those who wondered).

I saw a VERY near miss once between a high and low wing aircraft in a circuit. I was NORDO at the time so all I could do was watch it unfold. Not a nice feeling and something I hope I never experience again.

The sky is not quite as big as many people think.

LnS.