Flair Pilots

[Oleo 4]

Fellow aviators,

With all the uncertainty and speculation swirling around the industry in the last 48 hours and the many questions you all may have. I just wanted to create this thread in support of you and let you know that other pilots are hoping that positive news is the end result.

Regardless of the business model, you all have families and bills to take care of on the twilight of Covid, which was already decimating. As hard as it will be in the coming days and the noise that is in the media, take care of each other and try to limit any noise from interference in the flight deck. Focus on getting your passengers safely to destination.

O

[TylxrG]

Flair has great guys flying those 737s. Would be a shame if anything happened to their positions. They need positivity and unity right now! Wishing them the best!

[vrefplus5]

Oleo,

A very timely and compassionate gesture and no doubt will be kindly received by the folks there.

Thank you for taking the time to offer your support.

[North Shore]

Hear, hear, Oleo 4!

[post stickied]

[Arnie Pye]

Thank you very much. I know that there are far more people like you out there than the people rooting for our demise.
It's going to be chaotic and stressful for a while but the more times I go through this, the more you realize that this too shall pass.

Thanks for the support and encouragement.

[EPR]

Hear, hear, I agree with Oleo! #PilotUnity

[N181CS]

You know who hates pilots more then the delayed passenger or the companies they work for. Other Pilots…. It’s truly sad. Imagine if we all worked together. Great post.

[canadian_aviator_4]

No idea why any pilot would root for flair’s demise. More airlines means more vacancies and therefore a greater demand for pilots, resulting in better pay for all.

I know everything will go well for you guys. You are doing great!

[RoAF-Mig21]

You know who hates pilots more then the delayed passenger or the companies they work for. Other Pilots…. It’s truly sad. Imagine if we all worked together. Great post.

First and foremost, I agree that we all need to be united and work together for a common cause: a better industry with appropriate compensation and working conditions. Take that statement as my official possition.

The reason for the annymostity between pilots, not just in this country but all over the world, is that we're actually compeeting against each other. All of us strive to work for the best airlines, fly the best routes on the newest aircraft, have the best schedule and receive the highest pay, etc. Some will never make it to their dream jobs, because they either don't have the experience, skills, patience, character or (often) life circumstances prevent them from doing that. That breeds envy and distatin toward fellow pilots.

We live in a (Canadian style) capitalist society. The market normally dictates the opportunities that one has. Since not everyone can make it to "the top", however they define that, everyone else has a point at which they're willing to settle. We also have different opportunities. Some finish their pilot training at the age of 21, have family support in the industry, while others start in their 30s with no support.

Pilots at company A, flying a 737 may think that company B is willing to settle for less and company C are downright "scabs" for accepting the same job for "half the pay". The "top" pilots blame the "bottom" pilots for dragging them down and the "bottom" pilots blame the "top" pilots for taking everything for themselves and that things were handed to them on a silver platter. It's a neverending vicious cycle.

The reality is that no matter where you work in this industry, we're all connected and if one group suffers, the rest of us will suffer as well in some capacity. It would be nice if all Canadian pilots were part of the same union. We'd have a more unified voice. Maybe one day.

[cdnavater]

You know who hates pilots more then the delayed passenger or the companies they work for. Other Pilots…. It’s truly sad. Imagine if we all worked together. Great post.

First and foremost, I agree that we all need to be united and work together for a common cause: a better industry with appropriate compensation and working conditions. Take that statement as my official possition.

The reason for the annymostity between pilots, not just in this country but all over the world, is that we're actually compeeting against each other. All of us strive to work for the best airlines, fly the best routes on the newest aircraft, have the best schedule and receive the highest pay, etc. Some will never make it to their dream jobs, because they either don't have the experience, skills, patience, character or (often) life circumstances prevent them from doing that. That breeds envy and distatin toward fellow pilots.

We live in a (Canadian style) capitalist society. The market normally dictates the opportunities that one has. Since not everyone can make it to "the top", however they define that, everyone else has a point at which they're willing to settle. We also have different opportunities. Some finish their pilot training at the age of 21, have family support in the industry, while others start in their 30s with no support.

Pilots at company A, flying a 737 may think that company B is willing to settle for less and company C are downright "scabs" for accepting the same job for "half the pay". The "top" pilots blame the "bottom" pilots for dragging them down and the "bottom" pilots blame the "top" pilots for taking everything for themselves and that things were handed to them on a silver platter. It's a neverending vicious cycle.

The reality is that no matter where you work in this industry, we're all connected and if one group suffers, the rest of us will suffer as well in some capacity. It would be nice if all Canadian pilots were part of the same union. We'd have a more unified voice. Maybe one day.

We are our own worst enemy and a regulator of licences that could set a minimum wage for a job, maybe on a per seat basis would have a positive effect on how pilots view other pilots.
We all had our opinions on Flair at start up and then again when the contract was underwhelming, going back I still haven’t forgiven the WJ pilots for their grand entrance.
Anyhow, I don’t wish unemployment and starting over on anyone(one exception, you know who you are!) as said above, a company closing its doors will relieve pressure on the companies that were struggling to hire.
Good luck Flair pilots

[TeePeeCreeper]

I don’t wish unemployment and starting over on anyone(one exception, you know who you are!) as said above, a company closing its doors will relieve pressure on the companies that were struggling to hire.
Good luck Flair pilots

Thank you for showing us your true unabashed colours.

[cdnavater]

I don’t wish unemployment and starting over on anyone(one exception, you know who you are!) as said above, a company closing its doors will relieve pressure on the companies that were struggling to hire.
Good luck Flair pilots

Thank you for showing us your true unabashed colours.

You are welcome!
So, someone who causes nothing but harm to the profession by stepping over others to climb the ladder and shows no remorse gets your well wishes, ok. I’m thinking you may be related to Ghandi.
I am who I am and can empathize but certain people don’t deserve that, they deserve whatever Karma can throw at them, I will not post any further about that in this thread, it is supposed to be supportive for Flair pilots and I digress.

[highspeed]

Anyhow, I don’t wish unemployment and starting over on anyone(one exception, you know who you are!) as said above, a company closing its doors will relieve pressure on the companies that were struggling to hire.
Good luck Flair pilots

Means no pressure to improve terms and conditions.

Don't forget the reach around next time you're in your managers office.

[Ex DC10 Driver]

More bad news today https://weeklyvoice.com/flair-airlines- ... av-canada/

[digits_]

...

//edit: wrong topic

[Floop]

More bad news today https://weeklyvoice.com/flair-airlines- ... av-canada/

Not sure this support thread is the place for sharing news of more repos. Also not sure why a South Asian news site would be the one breaking the news, or how the planes could have been repod but no cancelations today yet.

Not saying it's inaccurate, but maybe let's wait until it's on an actual Canadian news site before treating it as fact.

[cdnavater]

Anyhow, I don’t wish unemployment and starting over on anyone(one exception, you know who you are!) as said above, a company closing its doors will relieve pressure on the companies that were struggling to hire.
Good luck Flair pilots

Means no pressure to improve terms and conditions.

Don't forget the reach around next time you're in your managers office.

Ok, for the slow minded, it’s not good for the industry and I am as far away from a company man as you can get, I’ve been extremely vocal about pilots who lower the bar, so read the whole fucking post in context, then comment, lest you come across as stupid!

[cdnavater]

Calling on all pilots but especially ALPA Pilots to contact your reps and petition to get Flair pilots DOH for pay at any ALPA carrier that hires them during this period of uncertainty.
To be clear, for any that decide the risk of staying is too much for them and they move now.
Should Flair rebound, the deal would be rescinded, I feel like if I was in this position I might hang on for dear life and be the one who shuts out the lights but if there was a more palatable option where I could move more latterly, I might consider it.

[bravo romeo]

Calling on all pilots but especially ALPA Pilots to contact your reps and petition to get Flair pilots DOH for pay at any ALPA carrier that hires them during this period of uncertainty.
To be clear, for any that decide the risk of staying is too much for them and they move now.
Should Flair rebound, the deal would be rescinded, I feel like if I was in this position I might hang on for dear life and be the one who shuts out the lights but if there was a more palatable option where I could move more latterly, I might consider it.

Sorry no chance of supporting this, contractually impossible. Ideally lateral movement within our industry should be possible, but it’s not.

[CFM Symphony]

Calling on all pilots but especially ALPA Pilots to contact your reps and petition to get Flair pilots DOH for pay at any ALPA carrier that hires them during this period of uncertainty.

Consider the precedent that would set. In future, it could allow pilots to work at the airline that offers them the fastest upgrade time even if that carrier is exposed to significant risk. Then when the airline fails, they get to slot in above others who made a conscious choice to park their name on a more stable airline's seniority list.

I wouldn't worry too much about the medium to long term fate of the Flair pilots - the industry will easily absorb them, but they will have to start anew. In the short-term though, a potential closure of an airline is going to weigh on their minds. I wish everyone and their families well.

[rando]

Calling on all pilots but especially ALPA Pilots to contact your reps and petition to get Flair pilots DOH for pay at any ALPA carrier that hires them during this period of uncertainty.
To be clear, for any that decide the risk of staying is too much for them and they move now.
Should Flair rebound, the deal would be rescinded, I feel like if I was in this position I might hang on for dear life and be the one who shuts out the lights but if there was a more palatable option where I could move more latterly, I might consider it.

Wut? Lol

[Just another canuck]

Calling on all pilots but especially ALPA Pilots to contact your reps and petition to get Flair pilots DOH for pay at any ALPA carrier that hires them during this period of uncertainty.
To be clear, for any that decide the risk of staying is too much for them and they move now.
Should Flair rebound, the deal would be rescinded, I feel like if I was in this position I might hang on for dear life and be the one who shuts out the lights but if there was a more palatable option where I could move more latterly, I might consider it.

I’m trying to imagine that phone call. Would my ALPA rep just hang up on me, or call me an idiot, then hang up on me?

Should the airline fail, the more senior members at Flair will be fine. Many will go back to being expats. The junior members are mostly young and haven’t been there long so this won’t have a long lasting impact on their careers. Considering other airlines in Canada could absorb the entire Flair pilot pool in about two months, they will be okay long term.

I wish everyone the best and especially their families in this stressful time.

[JakeLRS]

Lots of gloom being sent from non-flair pilots.

I'm very curious on what the internal consensus is with the entire situation. Has there been any communication from executives to any staff?

[RippleRock]

Calling on all pilots but especially ALPA Pilots to contact your reps and petition to get Flair pilots DOH for pay at any ALPA carrier that hires them during this period of uncertainty.
To be clear, for any that decide the risk of staying is too much for them and they move now.
Should Flair rebound, the deal would be rescinded, I feel like if I was in this position I might hang on for dear life and be the one who shuts out the lights but if there was a more palatable option where I could move more latterly, I might consider it.

My absolute #1 vote for the dumbest post ever.

[CaptDukeNukem]

Calling on all pilots but especially ALPA Pilots to contact your reps and petition to get Flair pilots DOH for pay at any ALPA carrier that hires them during this period of uncertainty.
To be clear, for any that decide the risk of staying is too much for them and they move now.
Should Flair rebound, the deal would be rescinded, I feel like if I was in this position I might hang on for dear life and be the one who shuts out the lights but if there was a more palatable option where I could move more latterly, I might consider it.

Yea man. I agree with everyone else. You’ve wrote some pretty dumb things here in the past but this takes the cake. What are you thinking?