David Duke gives Blitzer an ass-kickin.

[bmc]

Why is Israel so important to the US government? Why does it support Israel over and above any of the other 197 countries? I'm not making a statement to start a flame war, and apoligize up front if anyone is offended by that. I'm just asking a question.

[niss]

Dont forget Israel isnt the US's only ally in the ME. It has Saudi Arabia, Quatar, Turkey, Kuwait, Jordan, Lebanon, etc or at the very least diplomatic relations.

Israel however (IMO) is the most westernised nation there. So kind of a likes attract thing.

Also both countries have much to offer each other, more innovation and technology comes out of Israel than any other ME country. Just ask Motorola, Intel, etc.

[beechy]

So, Jews run the US.

There is more freedom of speech, religion and of identity in the middle east then in Europe and North America....

Come on, we are talking about the area were you are shot if you're gay, speak against islam or as a woman don't wear a sheet on your head etc......

Wow wish i could live there

I think the reason they went to IRAN to have that conference is perhaps because it is the only place that would allow a bunch of Jew Bashers to have a meeting.

[TopperHarley]

Why is Israel so important to the US government? Why does it support Israel over and above any of the other 197 countries? I'm not making a statement to start a flame war, and apoligize up front if anyone is offended by that. I'm just asking a question.

Because Israel is one of the only true democratic countries in the middle east. It is in the USA's best interest to support democracy in the middle east and to see that it spreads, seeing how the dictatorship and other regimes in that area are for the most part anti-American/West.

Many have argued that this was the USA's primary reason for going into Iraq in the first place (i.e. instill democracy in Iraq, and it will spread from there).

Now, I believe the US will direct their attention to Iran. Iran is clearly anti-zionist and anti-America, and this is in conflict with the US's interests.

And I wouldn't exactly call Saudia Arabia or Turkey "allies" to the USA. Lebanon is on the brink of being taken over by Hamas as well. Things are changing quickly in the middle east for the worse.

[2R]

Can you imagine what would have happened if Bush had of been in the white house after Pearl Harbour.
Would he of attcked the Japs who bombed Hawai or someone who looked like em .

If the primary purpose of going to Iraq was to prevent Isreal being attacked it will fail.Isreal is a big target and the Saudi's will continue to fund it's destruction.
The quickest way to peace would be to allow muslims to worship in one of their most holy sites under the dome of the rock.

Just like kindergarten the sandbox must be shared to avoid conflict

[niss]

actually 2R the dome of the rock was open to Muslims since Israel annexed East Jerusalem, its the Jews who arent allowed in it.

Israel has ensured that no holy site was desecrated and has allowed visitation to all people. Israel also granted control of certain religious sites to Muslim organizations just like the Tomb of the Patriarchs in Be'er Sheva.

Jews were not allowed to the western wall untill East Jerusalem fell to Israel in '67.

[grimey]

actually 2R the dome of the rock was open to Muslims since Israel annexed East Jerusalem, its the Jews who arent allowed in it.

Muslims may have some difficulty getting into Jerusalem (well, Israel period), though, due both to laws in their own country making travel to Israel illegal, and Israeli immigration making it (justifiably or not) somewhat of a pain for citizens of certain countries to enter.

[2R]

I guess i must have heard the CBC wrong again.Ithought that was one of the Biggest stumbling blocks to peace was how difficult it is for the children of Abraham to get along and share the holy sites .
It would be cheaper for all if they built a monorail system that allowed access to the holy sites but did not make any stops in areas that would resent the presence of pilgrims.A pilgrim train for devout people who want to honour God in their own way.
Or perhaps a Berlin airlift of sorts using helicopters to get the pilgrims to the holy sites .Lots of flying for pilots .So technically they would not be landing in Isreal but at a diplomatic embassy type deal.Or even tunnels the Egyptians have some good tunnel builders .
That would be better than all this unpleasantness that is there now.
It is difficult to imagine that such bitter enemies are all related by ancient bloodlines.

[niss]

It is difficult to imagine that such bitter enemies are all related by ancient bloodlines.

While I agree I still kind of feel it is unfair to call Jews and Muslims enemies.

I guess the radicals @#$! everything up for everyone.....

[PARADISE]

", BMC -Why is Israel so important to the US government? Why does it support Israel over and above any of the other 197 countries? I'm not making a statement to start a flame war, and apoligize up front if anyone is offended by that. I'm just asking a question."

'He who has the gold makes the rules'

[Dash-Ate]

Lest we forget also in ww2 we rounded up Japanese without a trial and put them in concentration camps. I bet many ordinary Canadians would have like to see them shot too. Our soldiers and cops were JUST FOLLOWING ORDERS!!! Sound familiar?

If they have been ordered to kill them they would have.
Right now we are rounding up muslims and openly torturing them without a trial (Saddam tactics).

So get it through your head EVERY race, culture is equally barbaric.

[still_bluenoser]

WW2 we were at war against japan. Now we are at war with extreme islam. Germany was not atacked by the Jews.

[altiplano]

...regimes in that area are for the most part anti-American/West... Iran is clearly anti-zionist and anti-America... Lebanon is on the brink of being taken over by Hamas as well. Things are changing quickly in the middle east for the worse.

And herein lies the problem. How do you know that C-HRIS? How have you come to accept that as fact? Watching TV? Reading what someone wrote?

I wonder what the rest of the story is. We all need to stop accepting what we see on TV as fact. Open your eyes and your minds to other possibilities rather than taking things for face value... If you believe everything you are being led to believe you have lost.

The media are not objective. They are not to be trusted from any side of this... They have motives beyond truth.

I will not believe that humanity hates itself as much as they tell us it does.

[niss]

'He who has the gold makes the rules'

You and Jet Dog going halvsies on a can of Zyklon B?

[TopperHarley]

...regimes in that area are for the most part anti-American/West... Iran is clearly anti-zionist and anti-America... Lebanon is on the brink of being taken over by Hamas as well. Things are changing quickly in the middle east for the worse.

And herein lies the problem. How do you know that C-HRIS? How have you come to accept that as fact? Watching TV? Reading what someone wrote?

I wonder what the rest of the story is. We all need to stop accepting what we see on TV as fact. Open your eyes and your minds to other possibilities rather than taking things for face value... If you believe everything you are being led to believe you have lost.

The media are not objective. They are not to be trusted from any side of this... They have motives beyond truth.

I will not believe that humanity hates itself as much as they tell us it does.

I will admit that I form the majority of my views from what I see in the news/media or what I read on the internet/newspapers. I know that there are many biased views and I am open minded about the possibility that I could be wrong in how I view these countries.

But much of what we see on the news is also pretty clear-cut. The hate from the radical Islamists is obvious. We see everyday how many people die as a result of their actions. I'm not saying all nations in the middle east are our "enemies," but I certainly would not go as far to call them our "allies" either.

I know there are many good people in countries like Lebanon. In fact, Lebanon is a country that has made much improvement over the years; however, they are also starting to become impacted by the radical Islamists. Hamas has clearly gained support in that area and the most recent assassination of the pro-democracy politician speaks for itself.

There are a lot of good people from these areas, but I just fear that the hate propagated by the radical Islamists is starting to create greater instability.

[grimey]

Who had the most to gain by the outright destruction of Iraq?

Iran, as is now obvious.

Why would Israel choose to orchestrate a war against a country which wasn't a threat due to international sanctions, and ignore one that was openly developing weapons and delivery systems which could hurt it?

The problem with your conspiracy theory is that it makes no sense, as Iraq was attacked, not Iran.

[altiplano]

C-HRIS c'mon man open your mind - read what you wrote.

I will admit that I form the majority of my views from what I see in the news/media or what I read on the internet/newspapers.

I know that there are many biased views and I am open minded about the possibility that I could be wrong in how I view these countries.

Then you just fall back it line...

But much of what we see on the news is also pretty clear-cut. The hate from the radical Islamists is obvious[b/]. We see everyday how many people die as a result of their actions.

How often are things in life "clear-cut"? I don't know about you but my life has never been black and white... Isn't it obvious that things are made to seem "clear-cut" for a reason? It creates a polarizing effect on society that serves their interests. Don't fall into it...

Remember this...

I know there are many good people in countries like Lebanon... There are a lot of good people from these areas...

And then imagine if we all thought that and "they" thought that about us. It's just like recycling - if we all try to make a difference we can make a difference... Stop throwing your mind in the trash.....

[altiplano]

Who had the most to gain by the outright destruction of Iraq?

Iran, as is now obvious.

Why would Israel choose to orchestrate a war against a country which wasn't a threat due to international sanctions, and ignore one that was openly developing weapons and delivery systems which could hurt it?

The problem with your conspiracy theory is that it makes no sense, as Iraq was attacked, not Iran.

You are both wrong. You guys are thinking too linear.

[grammar boy]

Religion Sucks. All of them.

Discuss...

[swede]

Who had the most to gain by the outright destruction of Iraq?

Iran, as is now obvious.

Why would Israel choose to orchestrate a war against a country which wasn't a threat due to international sanctions, and ignore one that was openly developing weapons and delivery systems which could hurt it?

The problem with your conspiracy theory is that it makes no sense, as Iraq was attacked, not Iran.

You are both wrong. You guys are thinking too linear.

I agree, black and white is the doublespeak dujour. Straight lines don't exist in todays politics, and what seems obvious, is nothing close. The ability to express ones opinions and thoughts is not the exclusive domain of academics and the elite. But that is what it has come down to, so that people like David Irving can go to jail for 3 years and clear their heads. Speaking of the conference in Iran, did anyone take note of the Chalabist Jews who were in attendance? Strange or what eh, the people who shriek holocaust denier are a just a little tongue tied over that. But fear not, the TV talking heads have brushed them off as "extremists". Give me a break

[Chantal]

The rest of the story is there's too much killing going on, over there, and now it's spread to Lebanon. You don't expect people to be angry? And whoever they are, is getting away with it, day after day and also, especially, nobody cares they just killed a Christian.

[niss]

Speaking of the conference in Iran, did anyone take note of the Chalabist Jews who were in attendance? Strange or what eh, the people who shriek holocaust denier are a just a little tongue tied over that. But fear not, the TV talking heads have brushed them off as "extremists". Give me a break

I took note of it, why dont you explain to the kind people on this forum why they were there swede. Did you read the part how they said that it was dispicable that there was a forum to deny the holocaust. They were there to protest it and the occupation.

[swede]

Speaking of the conference in Iran, did anyone take note of the Chalabist Jews who were in attendance? Strange or what eh, the people who shriek holocaust denier are a just a little tongue tied over that. But fear not, the TV talking heads have brushed them off as "extremists". Give me a break

I took note of it, why dont you explain to the kind people on this forum why they were there swede. Did you read the part how they said that it was dispicable that there was a forum to deny the holocaust. They were there to protest it and the occupation.

Sorry, close but no cigar. These guys with the black hats and big beards were in the conference room with the Iranian President and other attendees. You don't normally shake hands and embrace someone you are protesting against. They were having a regular love fest - as if the Iranians would allow Jewish protestors... . When I find the link I'll post it.

[grimey]

Iran, as is now obvious.

Why would Israel choose to orchestrate a war against a country which wasn't a threat due to international sanctions, and ignore one that was openly developing weapons and delivery systems which could hurt it?

The problem with your conspiracy theory is that it makes no sense, as Iraq was attacked, not Iran.

You are both wrong. You guys are thinking too linear.

I agree, black and white is the doublespeak dujour.

You agree you're wrong, swede?

Altiplano, who do you think had the most to gain? As far as my arguements for Iran: The Hussein government of Iraq gets overthrown. Meaning that a minority Sunni government gets tossed from power, and the majority Shia population gains a significant amount of power. Anti-American and Israeli sentiment is fueled by the US invasion, due to widespread conspiracy theories relating to zionism, allowing Iran to more easily infulence Iraqi affairs. They don't have to fear significant retribution from the Americans because the American forces are already occupied in Iraq, and there arn't sufficient resources to launch another war. We've already seen accounts of Iranian influence over the Shia population in Iraq, and the latest reports indicate that the US may be willing to negotiate with Iran over efforts to maintain some level of stability Iraq. So Iran has gone from having a major enemy on its border, to potentially having a large amount of influence over what is now a relatively friendly state. They also have substantially less to fear from the US now, regardless of their actions with respect to nuclear weapons.

How has any nation benefitted more than this from the second gulf war?

[bmc]

So, Jews run the US.

There is more freedom of speech, religion and of identity in the middle east then in Europe and North America....

Come on, we are talking about the area were you are shot if you're gay, speak against islam or as a woman don't wear a sheet on your head etc......

Wow wish i could live there

I did lived in the Middle East for three years. It was great. Safest place I have ever lived. Had our two daughters with us. Never locked the house, never locked the car. Didn't need to. The girls never needed to cover themselves. The wife drove. Four liquer stores. We lived in Bahrain which is predominantly Shiite. Met several Jewish families that have lived there for generations.

Other Middle Eastern countries are that free and liberal as well: Qatar, Abu Dhabi, Dubai, Oman, Kuwait. They're interesting places.