Hello

Discuss topics relating to Air Canada.

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Jeppesen
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Hello

Post by Jeppesen »

Hi there guys:

I've never really talked to anyone from Air Canada so I've never had the chance to learn how this bidding stuff works. Lets say I apply to Air Canada and I get accepted. What happens after that? They send to me their ground school..right? Is this ground school specifically for one plane? For example...I want to fly the b777... any chance I can come in straight to the right seat on the B777? Are there different ground schools? one for the embraer, one for the b777 etc?

Is it all a matter of what they need at that moment? ex; if they need crew for the embraer then they will only hire people for the embraer? After passing the interview do they tell you what plane you are going to fly if you pass ground school?


thanks to all.
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Four1oh
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Re: Hello

Post by Four1oh »

TOOOONNNNNEEEEEEE, oh TONY!? :smt040

*runs away*
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popo
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Re: Hello

Post by popo »

Hello , I am not sure if it is a joke, but oh well, I will respond.
Well Once you get hired...you will be given a course date.

a couple of weeks prior to that you will be sent some manual e.g FOM...
Flight operation Manual..which will explain how the company operate from a to z.
YOur 1st 2 weeks of GS will be mostly general stuff ..such as covering the FOM, CRM, Jet flying, DG, Wx, etc

Towards the end you will pull a number ( your seniority)...
and at the end of the 2 weeks, you will be able to bid on the positions that are available at that time.
That could be EMB, 320 or RP 67...77..etc.

Based on what you get..you will then be given manual and will start the GS/ CBT on the aircraft...

could be a long process..CBT= computer based training , after that you will have some Fixed base training to learn the SOP..before you Jump in the SIM.

Obviously you will be tested all along, written and Flight test/Validation to be able to move on to the next level.
After SIm...it is line indoc/line check....VOila.
all done for 6 months and then back in the box for some more. the training process would take about 3 months before you can fly the line.


Overall, very good training, pretty straight forward...1 step at the time.Lots to get done.
But effective.

Good luck.
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tonysoprano
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Re: Hello

Post by tonysoprano »

Four1oh wrote:TOOOONNNNNEEEEEEE, oh TONY!? :smt040

*runs away*
Yep, I'm speechless! Did you set this up? :lol:
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Jeppesen
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Re: Hello

Post by Jeppesen »

hey guys sorry I didn't explain myself better. It is not that I've been accepted to Air Canada or anything. I don't even have my ppl, just training towards one.

I just wanted to know a little bit more on how the industry works. That's it, Thanks to popo for his answer.

One more question regarding the process in Air Canada. Lets say someone not me this time :P, gets accepted and he passes all the GS and so on. If this person is put on the right seat of a b777, he spends there 5 years. When this person decides to upgrade to Captain will he have to "go down" to the Embraer o A320? Or can he upgrade to a b777 Captain? If he does upgrade would hes pay be as a 5 year Captain on the 777 or 1st year Captain?


thanks for your input again
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Rockie
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Re: Hello

Post by Rockie »

Air Canada has two things that determine what kind of aircraft and in what seat you are on. The first is a very strict seniority system that works on date of hire. The second is an almost indecipherable remuneration scheme that basically pays more money the bigger and heavier the aircraft. Imagine two vertical payscales, one for Captains and one for First Officers side by side, but the FO's is sitting about 40% lower. This means that a First Officer on a 777 gets paid less than the 777 Captain but more than an Embraer Captain. Every six months you have the opportunity to bid for equipment and seat and the outcome depends on your seniority and what people above you bid. When you start with the airline your total lack of seniority means you will get the lowest paying job, and that will be right seat on the Embraer or a cruise relief position on the 777, 330/340 or 767.

A new pilot won't see the right seat of the 777 for a long time, and won't see the left seat of the 777 for a loooooooooooooooooooooooooong time.
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TFE731
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Re: Hello

Post by TFE731 »

Greetings,

Just to clear up some misconceptions, you cannot get hired into the right seat of the B777. That is a very senior position and once you are hired at Air Canada, seniority is what grants you the position you seek, it has nothing to do with which fleet you're currently on or if you already have experience on a specific aircraft prior to getting hired at Air Canada.

Having said that, the entry level positions currently are:

Embraer First Officer
B767 Relief Pilot
B777 Relief Pilot

You can progress from EMB FO to EMB CA or.....
EMB FO to A320 FO back to EMB CA, there are several possible scenarios.

in these 2 instances, one does not get priority over the other just because he/she is currently flying the EMB, it is whoever has the seniority to hold the position he/she desires. Seniority is obviously built with the progression of time and specific to the base at which you're at. Some people may elect to stay as a B767 RP and transition to B767 FO once their relative seniority can hold this. This kind of transition would obviously take a lot more time than going from EMB FO to A320 FO for example since B767 FO is a much more senior position than EMB or A320 FO.

Hopefully some of these case examples help clarify the idea of seniority and progression at Air Canada. As for your question regarding pay, it is how many years you have been with the company not rank. So if after 5 years as an FO you transition to a CA, you will go into 6 yr CA pay based on the aircraft you are going on.

make any sense?! :rolleyes:
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Jeppesen
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Re: Hello

Post by Jeppesen »

it does make sense, Thanks for your explanation.
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Lost in Saigon
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Re: Hello

Post by Lost in Saigon »

Some of the newhire courses in 2000 sent pilots directly to the right seat of the B767. (flat pay for 2 years) This was a major piss-off to senior guys flying in more junior positions. But there was nothing they could do about it.

The new Position Group LOU has eliminated this for now.
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E-Flyer
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Re: Hello

Post by E-Flyer »

I don't even have my ppl, just training towards one.
Hopefully you know that a PPL won't suffice to fly for Air Canada.
I just wanted to know a little bit more on how the industry works
Knowing about the industry is great; however, there are people here who are much more senior than you and me on these forums that don't post in the Air Canada forums. Why? Cause they're not there in the industry yet. Maybe that's a good lesson learned.

You have far too many things to learn and worry about in comparison to what procedures are like at Air Canada. Focus on those, and come back when you're a potential candidate.

I think that's a fair statement?


Good Luck
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PilotFlying
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Re: Hello

Post by PilotFlying »

Asking questions is how you learn.

There is ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong with that. That's what these forums are for.

8)
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E-Flyer
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Re: Hello

Post by E-Flyer »

Then I've been taught wrong to bug off from the Airline Forum's then. I'll start bombarding u guys with questions ;)

Could I get .'s opinion on this before I actually go ahead and do this :prayer: ?

I would hate to start a thread and then get people to make it a flame thread; I just think that people should stick to where they belong. The odd question is fine, but operational questions or certainty's such as "when I get into Air Canada" should be saved for later as it won't do any good for the avid Student Pilot. If anything it'll encourage them to make a new user name and start acting like Mr.Airline Captain, and then we get troll's walking around. lol :wink:

My 2 cents
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Rockie
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Re: Hello

Post by Rockie »

Oh I don't know. If you wanted to be a firefighter wouldn't you ask a firefighter what his job is like? Any and all questions (within obvious reason) are fair game and the reason for this forum. I'll go out on a limb and guess your idol will say the same.
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PilotFlying
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Re: Hello

Post by PilotFlying »

There is no sacred territory in the airline forums. It is just a bunch of pilots talking about pilot-related things that fall under the subject of the forum - just like the rest them. Usually it is mostly the guys/gals of the airline talking about common subject matter, but that doesn't mean others aren't welcome. What better place to get information from the source?

Flaming in ANY forum is unwelcome.

Trolls in ANY forum are unwelcome.

So let's just keep that stuff clear of everyone, and feel more than welcome to post any questions you have - in or out of your league - where they most appropriately belong.

Maybe the moderators will disagree, as this is just my opinion. But I would doubt it.

Anyway, back on topic...

8)
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4Stroke
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Re: Hello

Post by 4Stroke »

E-Flyer wrote:

Knowing about the industry is great; however, there are people here who are much more senior than you and me on these forums that don't post in the Air Canada forums.

You have far too many things to learn and worry about in comparison to what procedures are like at Air Canada. Focus on those, and come back when you're a potential candidate.

I think that's a fair statement?
E-Flyer, take a chill pill. I think that a young'n starting out NEEDS to be asking any and ALL questions....even though they may not see an airliner seat for years to come. I think it's great that someone wants to know the ins and outs of flying at Big Red!

Why you ask??? Well, if someone felt like they could ask questions without being told to pound sand, maybe they'll get to know more about this industry, and make SMARTER career decisions (ahem.....training bonds, sketchy operators, etc??).

wouldn't that be a good thing for all of us??? :goodman:

So, let's hear more of those questions from Jeppesen and others.

4Stroke
:smt040

I
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E-Flyer
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Re: Hello

Post by E-Flyer »

I'm one of those others, so I guess I'll be more active here then.

I am not going to take a chill pill hehe, because the vibe I got from you guys was that you don't want 200 hr noobs posting here. It apparently was a "waste of your time." Since it now isn't I've got a ton of questions.


Cheers
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babybus
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Re: Hello

Post by babybus »

Jeppesen,

It's a pleasure to answer newbies questions.We were all there at one time.
I remember that when I was 12 and wanted to be a pilot, my high school guidance counselor put me in touch with an Air Canada pilot.He was very patient and spent lots of time answering my questions such as where does he layover,how many hours does he fly,how do you get hired at Air Canada etc...
And I wasn't even a PPL but I was facinated by the airlines.
He never told me to call him back when I was 21 and had an ATPL.I would also visit the pilots on every single trip I took as a kid and asked those vey same stupid questions every time and the pilots always treated me like one of their one because we shared the same passion.
There are no stupid questions just stupid answers.Any professional Air Canada pilot will treat you with respect and answer your questions so don't let some of thes comments posted here put you off.
p.s there is no waste of time on this forum because if these guys time was so precious they wouldn't be here chatting in the first place.
Good luck and keep the questions coming...you too e-flyer
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E-Flyer
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Re: Hello

Post by E-Flyer »

I've been a long time reader in these forums and hence picked up on the culture that airline guys stick to them selves. But then again, how do you tell who is an airline guy here? so many people tend to say they're this this and that while they're nothing but a kid who gets no attention at home. When I registered to participate I isolated my self from here too due to the influence of the comments I'd witnessed in these forums.

Thanks for showing that you guys are true professionals who do not mind talking to the new people in this industry.
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Topspin
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Re: Hello

Post by Topspin »

Back to the original topic, just out of curiosity, how long is AC's seniority list?
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PilotFlying
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Re: Hello

Post by PilotFlying »

E-Flyer wrote:...the vibe I got from you guys was that you don't want 200 hr noobs posting here.
I would doubt there is anyone at Air Canada with this kind of an attitude, and if there is, I would be truly ashamed.
babybus wrote:Any professional Air Canada pilot will treat you with respect and answer your questions...
Here is a exactly what I am talking about.


So, as I said, don't be shy!

Cheers,

8)
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PilotFlying
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Re: Hello

Post by PilotFlying »

Topspin wrote:Back to the original topic, just out of curiosity, how long is AC's seniority list?
Approximately 3400.

8)
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Rockie
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Re: Hello

Post by Rockie »

E-Flyer wrote:I've been a long time reader in these forums and hence picked up on the culture that airline guys stick to them selves. But then again, how do you tell who is an airline guy here? so many people tend to say they're this this and that while they're nothing but a kid who gets no attention at home. When I registered to participate I isolated my self from here too due to the influence of the comments I'd witnessed in these forums.

Thanks for showing that you guys are true professionals who do not mind talking to the new people in this industry.
It's true there is a sizable component on this forum that jumps down the throat of the 200 hour pilot for some percieved infraction. But I would be willing to bet those people only have around one more zero to add to the hours tally and get real pleasure out of putting newbie's in their place. Most people though don't feel they need to assert their self-percieved superiority and are happy to answer questions without getting cocky about it. Ask away and don't be discouraged by junior generals.
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E-Flyer
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Re: Hello

Post by E-Flyer »

Ok Awesome !

Thanks for the maturity.
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Four1oh
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Re: Hello

Post by Four1oh »

ok, ok, that's enough stroking! Now ask some questions! ;)

Jeppesen, sorry about my original comment, but it looked initially like a troll to me, my bad. Absolutely now IS the time you should be asking as many questions as you can, but not just the Airline dudes, you need to find out how they got to where they are too, so ask the commuter guys, ask the Air Taxi guys, etc. Get the whole picture before you make a very important career decision. Who knows, you may decide that this is crazy and you decide on a well-paid, fulfilling career in IT, or you may just want in on the insanity! :)
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Re: Hello

Post by . . »

I would agree about learning how to get to the airlines. There's no point in deciding it's the job you want, and having no idea of the hoops you'll have to jump through to get there. Definitely something I had no concept of when I finished my training.
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