Caravan FO?

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Kelowna Pilot
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Caravan FO?

Post by Kelowna Pilot »

I saw a job advert for a Caravan FO...

What does a Caravan FO do other than add weight to the plane and add to fuel costs?
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Crazymax
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Post by Crazymax »

You have a second pilot to make sure everything is okay. What about safety???

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wallypilot
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Post by wallypilot »

Could be a corporate operator that requires to 2 pilots on all flights. As far as what they do, well, the same thing as a navajo copilot, i guess. In crappy IFR wx, 2 pilot crew reduces workload and is much more relaxed than single pilot.

I have worked with a caravan VFR for a client that requires 2 pilots at all times. Basically one gets to nap for an hour, then trade off! I must say, though, in claggy IFR, it's nice to have a pilot in the right seat.
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Johnny
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Post by Johnny »

wallypilot wrote:Could be a corporate operator that requires to 2 pilots on all flights. As far as what they do, well, the same thing as a navajo copilot, i guess. In crappy IFR wx, 2 pilot crew reduces workload and is much more relaxed than single pilot.
Also allows for longer duty day in IFR ops.
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bob sacamano
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Post by bob sacamano »

With 1000 hours these days, you can do alot better than van f.o.
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Re: Caravan FO?

Post by DHQ »

Kelowna Pilot wrote:I saw a job advert for a Caravan FO...

What does a Caravan FO do other than add weight to the plane and add to fuel costs?
What does an FO on a twin otter or king air do?
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mellow_pilot
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Post by mellow_pilot »

What's an FO?

(no I'm not serious)
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LostinRotation
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Re: Caravan FO?

Post by LostinRotation »

Kelowna Pilot wrote:
What does a Caravan FO do other than add weight to the plane and add to fuel costs?
Anything but taxi the A/C :lol:


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Brize
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Re: Caravan FO?

Post by Brize »

Kelowna Pilot wrote:What does a Caravan FO do other than add weight to the plane and add to fuel costs?
Same thing as the BE20 F/O. Well, their thumb and index fingers are a little stronger from working the gear hangle 50% of the time, leading to chin being carried a little higher due a feeling of being a little more important in life.
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mbav8r
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Post by mbav8r »

Should always have a pen in the left sleeve pen pocket in case the capy needs one. :P
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Post by snag »

Hard to believe that in this day and age with all the CRM training and safety information there are still bush idiots out there with their head burried in the sand about copilots.

Aside from splitting the workload, they are there to learn from your clearly superior skills, and possibly save you from looking like a moron, or bending your plane. Regardless of aircraft.
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Post by Hedley »

I've always thought the guy in the right seat of a Caravan or 172 or Cherokee should honest about what's going on, and just log dual.

There's nothing wrong with logging dual. Really. It even counts 100% towards your ATPL :lol:
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Post by Cat Driver »

" Hard to believe that in this day and age with all the CRM training and safety information there are still bush idiots out there with their head burried in the sand about copilots. "

Yup, and in spite of all these training programs there are still about the same percentage of crews bending expensive airplanes.

So maybe the real truth is an idiot with CRM is still an idiot?

And for flying skills I'll take the bush idiot anyday.
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Post by Doc »

snag....there are an awful lot of bent airplanes by two crew ops. There is no need for an FO in a 'van!
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Crazymax
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Post by Crazymax »

Tell that to the guy down to the minimums on the misse and overloaded...

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Post by Rudy »

Doc wrote:snag....there are an awful lot of bent airplanes by two crew ops. There is no need for an FO in a 'van!
There's a lot of accidents involving aircraft that have two wings as well. By your logic one wing should be enough.
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Post by jetway »

Good Grief, what kind of Asshole Captains are we producing. 2 Crew is often a requirement in many places... What gets me is that the All Mighty Captain of, let's say a BE20 for argument's sake, should be switching legs on every single flight... Why, the old 'joke' saying of "gear up, flaps up,. shut up" only comes to be because some old farts actually operate that way. Sure, FO on a single may not have it's own pretty column in the log book; who cares. If you are a 300 hour pilot sitting right seat on a Van, PC-12, etc..., you have so many opportunities to learn things from your Capt, and fly every other leg. Two engines doesn't make a plane any more complex. If you want proof of that, look at any old beat up King Air, and then have a gander into a PC-12. One of these things is NOT like the other. Hell, I would take a PC-12 on some days when my aged jet is "doing it again".
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Post by trey kule »

Cat wrote:
So maybe the real truth is an idiot with CRM is still an idiot?
I love it. Hope you dont mind if I use it.

Despite the hurt egos here, for the most part an FO is really not needed in some of these planes. Because of insurance, corporate, or customer requirements they put one on board. Proof of this is that they dont require, in most cases that the FO really have the experience to command the plane.Or really very much experience at all for their job is as a Capt's asst.

What burns me up is when someone posts that it is the Capts job to teach the FO.....now how are you a functioning crewmember if you think your job is to learn...and I dont mean learn from experience so dont give me that motherhood "we should always be learning"

Having said all that it is nice when things are going to hell in handbucket some times to have the second person in the cockpit.....well either that or a good autopilot.

I feel sorry for all those FO's who buy the BS that they are an intregal part of a Caravan crew.
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Post by Cat Driver »

" should be switching legs on every single flight... Why, the old 'joke' saying of "gear up, flaps up,. shut up" only comes to be because some old farts actually operate that way. "
Why is there the assumption that only " old farts " are guilty of not sharing the flying?

I get so fed up with the attitude by many pilots that to be old somehow makes one less worthy of respect than all these young aces.

So in defense of the "OLD" pilots let me outline what you would find if you flew as FO with me.

First there is no way I am going to do half the flying because I prefer to let the FO do most of the flying including take offs and landings, it's so much easier monitoring them than having to do it myself. Not that I can't it's just I have been doing it so long don't " NEED " to.

So you have to do about 80% of the flying.

If you were lacking in flying skills to the point that you keep making the same mistakes over and over you would not be flying with me for long.

If your attitude was such that you were to stupid to show respect for your elders you would not be flying with me period.
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The hardest thing about flying is knowing when to say no


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Post by ScudRunner »

Hard to believe that in this day and age with all the CRM training and safety information there are still bush idiots out there with their head burried in the sand about copilots.
Bush Idiots?? :roll: WHO YOU CALLING IDIOT BOYY?

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Should always have a pen in the left sleeve pen pocket in case the capy needs one.

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Rowdy
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Post by Rowdy »

Scuddy.. you can be my wingman anytime!
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Post by jetway »

By old farts, I didn't realize I was picking on old guys (soon myself) but I suppose "old School Farts" Flatulent in the brain, so to speak. I know I may have been soured by one "Fart" who tarnsihed the reputation of all you experienced men ( and Women). my apologies, he just really pissed me off the way I saw him treat his King Air FO. Bah - Apologies, Cat. :oops:

Truly, from an "old fart' in training - advanced training
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Post by sky's the limit »

snag wrote:Hard to believe that in this day and age with all the CRM training and safety information there are still bush idiots out there with their head burried in the sand about copilots.

Aside from splitting the workload, they are there to learn from your clearly superior skills, and possibly save you from looking like a moron, or bending your plane. Regardless of aircraft.

I find it hard to believe there are pilots wandering around who seem to think that flying SINGLE PILOT airplanes SINGLE PILOT is some Neanderthal thing to do.... I'm not sure how people fly SPIFR all the time without getting killed....???? Come on. A well trained, experienced pilot in MOST airplanes is more than capable of handling the job. If you're not, you may want to reconsider your career choice.

300hr pilots can do precious little to "reduce" workload - most can't find their arsehole with a flashlight on a good day, much less when something goes wrong.

If you can't find ANYTHING else, sure being Right Seat Meat is better than nothing, but as Hedley says, it's Dual.

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Post by Cat Driver »

jetway:

There are as.holes in every grop, unfortunately aviation seems to attract more than most other jobs.

I like all pilots who have flown in two crew airplanes have suffered under the " Captain" complex as.holes and made a vow never to treat any crew member like they did.

Two things make for a tyrant in the cockpit.

(1) A deep seated inferiority due to a lack of flying skills.

(2) The title of " Captain " which they use as a club to abuse others.

In the final analysis they are pathetic.
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The hardest thing about flying is knowing when to say no


After over a half a century of flying no one ever died because of my decision not to fly.
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Post by Crazymax »

Sky: One should be able to do it all by himself but really, what's wrong with making someone fly in the right seat of a van. It's just safer...

Max
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