Partnevia P 68

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kev1.1
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Partnevia P 68

Post by kev1.1 »

anone knows if there s a P68 anywhere in Canada?
thanks
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by HS-748 2A »

C-FLIR Vision Air
C-GJMZ Jackson Air Services

http://www.airport-data.com/aircraft/photo/037284.html

http://www.jacksonair.ca/

Here's the link to T.C.'s Register (hard to find these days)

http://www.tc.gc.ca/aviation/activepage ... n/menu.asp

'48
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MichaelP
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by MichaelP »

Good aeroplane, I ran the numbers on it once and for the purposes then it was a better deal than a Seneca.
It's strange that such an aeroplane did not catch on so well here.
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mcrit
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by mcrit »

The one we used to fly was a bit of a hangar queen. Not sure if that was just our individual airplane or fleet wide.
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by MichaelP »

The one we used to fly was a bit of a hangar queen.
Please elucidate...
It would be of interest to me to learn why.

I know there were some AD's to attend to with the older P68s, but this aircraft is in current production: http://www.vulcanair.com/

I knew of a couple of P68 Oscars in the UK, one of which you could rent, and I see there are P68s for rent in Australia.

This sort of thing is always interesting, I have come across many aeroplanes that operate successfully all over the world but have some sort of trouble here in North America.

From Wikipedia:
Image
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by HS-748 2A »

mcrit wrote:The one we used to fly was a bit of a hangar queen.
Those 0-360s burried in the wing are reminicsent of the 540s in the Aerostar.. Not too nice to get at.

Generally, the high-wing, fixed gear, 0-360s and Hartzells bode well for low maint.

They don't look as nice with the all-glass front but I bet it's a nice view.

I am interested to hear though, first hand, from somebody who knows them.

They look fun to fly.
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by mcrit »

The engines in ours kept spitting out parts and doing other funky stuff. The engineer would work on it for a week, it would fly for 10 or so hours and then blow a jug/spring an oil leak/loose a mag., Like I said, it could have just been our airplane. When it was flying it was kinda fun, nothing really special though.
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Hedley
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by Hedley »

Perhaps the engines had previously experienced a varsol overhaul?

The Lyc O-360 is generally a pretty bulletproof engine, compared
to some others. I know some people who give them some pretty
rough treatment (eg Pitts S-1T, S-2A, Giles 202) and they seem to
take it quite impressively.

In a straight-and-level application, they seem to work pretty well,
a little attention to the baffles and seals helps to keep the CHT's
down.

Oops, I lie. I know a fellow who just had a problem with his Lyc
O-360 in his homebuilt. At 200KTAS the oil pressure went to zero,
and he didn't have an aerobatic (counterweighted) prop, just a
normal, 2-blade metal constant speed Hartzell prop, so it went
to fine pitch and 4000 RPM. No typo. Ouch.

Engine was overhauled and NDT'd, but in surprisingly good shape.
New rod bolts, etc. Prop was scrapped, I hope it was destroyed
so some other homebuilder doesn't try to use it. He bought a
(counterweighted) MT to replace it, so next time he loses oil
pressure, it will go coarse, and the rpm will decrease.

On the subject of 4-cyl Lycs ... on many of them, oil full is 8
qts, windage level is 6 qts. However, it is quite easy to unport
it, so I would recommend running it FULL for all flights, with
an air-oil separator, if you are going to try any funny stuff.
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by C-GPFG »

I wonder what happened to this one that used to be based at YTZ....

Image
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mcrit
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by mcrit »

Fire patrol in N Ontario last I heard.
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by MichaelP »

The new smaller version has two advanced technology Rotax 912 engines, much more efficient and perhaps more reliable?

Image

An aircraft should not be criticised for its unlucky engines. As Hedley wrote, the IO-360 is normally bullet proof.
The P68 is a better proposition IMHO than a Seneca... Especially here in the wet coast.

mcrit: what was it's short field performance like?
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by mcrit »

MichaelP wrote:mcrit: what was it's short field performance like?
I don't recall numbers right off the top of my head (I'll have to dig out a POH)
It does have the Seneca beat in an x-wind.
I by the picture you posted the new PN68 has rectractable gear, I'll be that gives it a few knots over its older brother.
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by MichaelP »

The aeroplane in the picture is a Tecnam P2006 twin, it has two 100hp Rotax 912s and is built by the same people...
It has a glass cockpit and would fit in well with our Katanas if TC approval of it as an IFR machine was forthcoming.
Imagine flying a twin at a little more than Cessna 172 cost!

I always liked the look of the Partenavia.
How many are registered in Canada and are any of them for sale?
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OntheNumbers
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by OntheNumbers »

According to the Online registry lookup, there are precisely 2 Partenavia's both of which have been mentioned on this post. A historical search shows there was a third plane - CGANW - which was deleted from the registry for some reason in January of 2004.

Scarce bird in these parts.
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Big Pistons Forever
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by Big Pistons Forever »

Anyone know if TC still prohibits training for the ME rating on fixed gear twins ?
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by iflyforpie »

Big Pistons Forever wrote:Anyone know if TC still prohibits training for the ME rating on fixed gear twins ?
My old company sold an ex-Sonic Blue Islander to an AME that he used for his ME rating.
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airbournesailor
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by airbournesailor »

There was one in Labrador a few years ago owned by Labrador Travel Air. The company is no more, don't know what happened to the AC. Looked like a great plane for gravel strips with the high wing.
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by mcrit »

Big Pistons Forever wrote:Anyone know if TC still prohibits training for the ME rating on fixed gear twins ?
No, that restriction is dead. A company at YTZ used the PN68 for multi training from 97 til about 2003 when they went under.
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sidestick stirrer
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by sidestick stirrer »

I, too, thought they looked like a terrific airplane. Not too many exceptions to the old aviation saw about flying right if it looks right.
Great idea, Michael, it would indeed look right at home with your fleet.
Too bad about that one that shed a wing during an airshow, while the pilot's wife was doing the announcing for his act...
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by MichaelP »

The video of the wing shedding is well and truly engraved on my memory.

There was an incident of a Cessna 172 doing aerobatics locally, this was partly to blame for a school closing down...
Then a student here was relating the fact that the uncle owned a Cessna 172 and did aerobatics in it from this airport!
The barrel roll, while being a low stress manoeuvre, can go horribly wrong with high Gs and Vne speeds or greater...

One would have to ask how many times the pilot of the P68 got it wrong before doing it at an airshow?

Fools practice aerobatics in strictly non aerobatic aircraft.

As Norman Jones had placarded in all his aircraft: "All aircraft bite fools".

You've got me thinking!
http://www.controller.com/listings/airc ... 803B&dlr=1

I believe the odd Aero Commander has lost its wings, but Bob Hoover flew them well aerobatically. Smooth control inputs using low Gs requires the hands of a master.

It would be interesting to know how many P68s have crashed due to structural failure.
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by BWL »

For those who used to be at the Island, lost track of Carlos. Where is he these days??
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by Sabrea »

The P68B flys quite like a 206 with the forward field of veiw being better. They could get up and go at 165kts bellow 10k and still had good short field ops. I found that the major problem was keeping on top of the fuel managment and trimming as every minute action could produce a large reaction (or lack thereof). All in all, not a bad light twin to fly. I also trained for twin IFR on this ac.
As for maintenance, they have some quirks and some odd ball design "features". Some parts of the aircraft that are produced locally in Italy are metric sized, mainly for adjustment purposes and specialty fit items. The control cables to the back of the ac have VERY high tensions (I have seen a 1/16 trim cable exceed 125 pounds) and were originally offered in carbon steel or stainless steel. I beleive that having stainless steel required for cable run inspections in an untensioned state every 100hrs. The trim drum cable is wound onto the front and rear drum as an endless loop and has no means of preventing slippage on the wheel drum and therefore can loose its position indictor setting. There is a recurring ad at 25 and 50 hrs in some contract states. Big flat bottomed fuel tanks can hide water away from the drains and the fuel selectors can be a pain to rig, especially with a mix of new gears/old cables. And for the powerplants, lets just say that working on them is "tight"
All said and done, I have seen and possibly contributed too the abuse of this type and it still seems to keep going.
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by mcrit »

BWL wrote:For those who used to be at the Island, lost track of Carlos. Where is he these days??
Which one?
Last I heard Carlos the founder was working for a charter company in YYZ and dodging legal assassins from ATI's recievers. Carlos the instructor was at Toronto Airways/Canadian Flyers last I saw him.
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Re: Partnevia P 68

Post by bluenote »

Which Carlos are we talking about here?

The founder of ATR way back in the 90's, he was on a leave of absence from Air Canada for 5 years until 2008 and was down in Florida, is this the same guy dodging the issues from ATI. I heard he did not have anything to do with ATI's funny business.
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